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What Are You Trying To Achieve With Your Songs?


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Posted

Hi gang

 

When you write a new song, what sort of things are you trying to achieve? What is your purpose(s)?

 

I get that you probably try to do more than one thing and sometimes an individual song has a clear purpose... but what sort of things and where does the balance lie?

 

For example, for me, I try to connect with my audience. Not just in terms of understanding. An emotional connection. Something shared.

 

Sometimes I might be trying to convey a very specific message, but mostly I just hope that listeners have a feeling that someone else gets them. Someone else is on a similar journey, or at least going through a familiar landscape.

 

Other times it's just about that song, that moment and nothing else.

 

What about you?

 

Cheers

 

John

  • Like 3
Posted
17 hours ago, john said:

Other times it's just about that song, that moment and nothing else.

That's usually it for me, I tend to muddy things up too much if ever really try to think about it, and if there ever was a "message" it just gets convoluted and comes across pretentious, it's usually just a certain emotion or in the moment feeling.   

 

1 hour ago, MikeRobinson said:

I just want to write something that I'd like to listen to.

and that too! Just something I wouldn't immediately hate and turn off if I heard someone else doing it, at least in some aspect that peaks my interest, be it some wordplay, or an fx or riff or certain progression, or whatever I find intriguing.  

  • Like 2
Posted
5 hours ago, Anaezia said:

To share the feelings that I am feeling at the moment. But I don't write what i feel hmmm. 


Interesting. Can you explain a little more of what you mean. An example maybe? :)

Posted

this  is  a  interesting  question  and   dilemma   for    me   i  have   been   working   on  a  few  different   projects   i  have  been  writing  a  song  for  the   hitsong  challenge     and    i  have  a  operatic  pop  song    which  i  want  to  collaberate  with   a  classical   composer   and   i  have  got  incontact  with   a  up  and  coming  young   female   vocalist  .  both   projects   i  am  passionate    about   .  with   this   covid  the   local   recording   studio   i was  working   with  had  to  shut to  the  public  .  the  recording   studio   said   they  would  record  one  song   for   me  and   if  they  could  do  more  they  would  do  more  at  a   later   date  . so   you   can  emagine   it   felt   like   you  were   stuck  on  the  top  of  a   cliff  holding 2 people  one  in  each   hand   but  you  could  only   save  one  .  which   do  you   choose   . this   was   hard  i  had  to choose    one  to  record   and   the  other   hopefully  they  would   record    soon  .  i   in  the   end   had  to  take   a  coin and  toss  it   heads  for  the  hitsong  challenge   and  tails   for  the  operatic  pop   song   .  tails   won     and  i  got  it  recorded   and   sent  it  to   the  classical  composer  that  does   film   scores   and    he  loves  it   and  is  going  to  collaberate  on  it   and   hopefully    the  singer   that  is  going  to   hear  it  will   want   to  record  it   . i  now   am  waiting  for   the   song  for  the  hitsongchallenge  to  be  recorded  for     my  A team  to  work   on   

  • Like 2
Posted

I do it for fun. I try my best, sometimes I succeed, many times I don't. I can usually listen to the songs for a while. Then they disappear, and years later when I hear them again, I say "good" or "what the hell was I thinking?"

  • Like 3
Posted
On 11/6/2020 at 8:55 PM, john said:


Interesting. Can you explain a little more of what you mean. An example maybe? :)

The lines just come to my head and I try to extend it. Turn it into a story but I am still learning. Feelings are not really included but I'm still learning. 

  • Like 1
  • Editors
Posted

When I'm writing my own songs, it is often that I don't consider the perspective of the listener or how they should perceive it. What Mike said is closer to my own sentiment. I'm constantly hearing the words and the melodies in my head and there's a subconscious player watching my every move and comparing it with my emotional and musical intuition/situation in the moment. It feels like I'm trying to get rid of an itch.

 

I feel like the deeper I try to explore the song's purpose in being clearly expressed, the more I find out about myself. And the more my songs come from 'that place', the ability to connect with the listener becomes stronger. (Again, I'm only speaking from my personal experience without denying other ways of achieving the same). I guess maybe this is because ultimately, the human emotion is a common one among all.

 

On the other hand, I've had some queries lately from the local film industry here for some writing work in English. The songs/tunes generally would be in the context of where it appears in the movie and what's happening in the story. This requires me to spend sometime from the perspective of the character in the movie, the listener and more. And it has allowed me to improve my skills greatly! Being able to cater to a requirement with your artistic skills is definitely something you want to hone.

  • Like 2
  • Editors
Posted
2 hours ago, ImKeN said:

I'm trying to make money with my music, not an easy task!!

 

 

HAHAHA Bottom line! I hear you BIG time Ken. sigh

  • Like 1
  • 3 weeks later...
Posted

Lyrics are a form of communication, we communicate to the other / listener what WE WANT TO SAY. 

 

This is complex of course and whether it be an emotion or story the lyric tells what we want to say, a protest song, love song, story, advice or history. Once we have written the words we try and enhance it with melody and rhythm.

 

Sure we are the first to hear and critique our own work and as such it has to please ourselves, but we already know what we are saying and then it is trying to ensure that others and generally most important aspect of the communication is understood by others. 

 

In the modern idiom, the short attention span is an important paradigm that must be understood, youth especially text complex ideas with just emojis and short text messages. Lyrics should written to communicate and hence this has to be taken into account. Some hit song writer had his extensive list of hit songs analysed and the language is at Grade 4 Level, basic communication levels at best.

 

Must have written over 50 songs inspired just by Shawshank Redemption, the feelings of helplessness, hope, joy, broken love etc are all there.

 

It gives us the opportunity to still tell a story that is a little too close to the heart but by changing all the protagonists, making it more universal or in some cases, easier to sing live!! As example I have a song called "Hurts to Remember " which actually is about Mum returning to the family home after dad died, quarter acre block and a 1956 house they built where a family of 9 lived, now mum opening up the front door and it is just her.

 

No way could I sing this live, no way known, so changed it all around where it is a daughter leaving home but tried to keep the emotion of loss. Know sometimes the actual real story wells up my eyes when I have played it out there, but the writing of the emotion is cathartic and that people have enjoyed it and even requested it, neat.

 

 

this I do often, keep the feeling but change the who what and where. 

 

The funniest thing I have heard is that how can a older person write a song to young people, derrrr, love hasn't changed, anger remains etc. The choice of language evolves but we are all part of it and back to the hit writer, dumb it down even further for a pop song lol

 

That said I go and do lots of open mics playing to the teens and reference their reactions as to whether a song works

etc. Playing it out and getting real time reaction is so important and the one thing that covid has taken from me that hurts.

  • Like 2
  • 1 month later...
Posted

Strangely you are agreeing with me! Somewhere over a rainbow is basically a short ditty, not a Dylonesque tome of part nonsense rhyme and open statements. The timelessness of the song is the wistful longing creating a universal appeal in a lovely melody.

 

It doesn't contrive for educational brilliance but has a childlike quality that believes in magic of a rainbow which science tells us is pretty humdrum refraction of light.

 

This idiom is unchanged and magnified for the tweet generation, as songwriters we have to meet somewhere between for indulgences and the market reality. 

  • Like 2
Posted

Again QED, the hit was a short song not the original longer version, other than being a wonderful start, most people dont know all the words of the song as it stands now - we played it a few times on our Friday singalong and sure they sang Somewhere over the rainbow, but after this the mouthing on the zoom feeds dried up.

 

We the writer have the right to how we write a song and whether we take the choices that will make it more palatable to the listeners and to a degree our audience. We the writer have to accept the audiences right whether they choose to listen or turn off.

 

For mine I choose not to swear or perform dirty songs per se, edgey is fine but there is a line and choose also not do the pop style of the hook sung incessantly and taped sampling etc. Also choose to use conversational language as much as humanely possible in the Nashville way and refuse to be slave to and therefore minimize change just to achieve rhyme.

 

Also make no bones that I want my songs to be commercial, that is liked by others, there is nothing better than having someone not just I liked that song (nice but too often just being polite) but it really hit a spot etc..

 

That is commercial and as I believe that the human emotional genome has not changed and it is emotion that we are trying to appeal to with music and melody, be great if enough people liked it and actually made enough for a few beers or extra zeros in the back account as well.

 

Putting songs up for critique - not just plaudits - is about making the song more universal and therefore more commercial, irrespective of how we call it, popular, commercial, liked, appreciated, loved etc. this all the same we want the song to be by as many people as possible (irrespective of which people they are, young old goth, rocker, punk heavy metal classical etc.) liked and tailoring songs to be liked is commercial song writing.

 

 

Posted

Ha Ha, Not doubting your credentials Joel, myself got no runs on the board! What is interesting is you still require validation from those 3 and the critics so to speak, so the music is not entirely just for you and this is important, whether we call it commercial, likeable or some other term such as validated is an important aspect of what we are doing.

 

If it is not just for us / I, it fits under the umbrella. Respect your right as to your opinion on what this constitutes but conversely, respect for the great unwashed and disinterested must also be allowed to what they see as 'good'.

 

Sure now you will already be saying that you don't care, they are mindless etc. but they do have the right and hence this must be respected and not necessarily putting them down for it. The songs you quote and writers you note were all commercial, however the song writers would never have anticipated todays world of sampling and electronic beats, my what could they have done with this.

 

I am coming from this wanting to be a professional writer, make no bones about it, not hiding behind just saying its for me so if I don't make it my ego is protected, no, chins out proud in the wind waiting to be potted. My one saving grace is that I know everything I do is not of sufficient quality or even close, but each one takes me a step closer to a dream, whether realized or not.

 

 

Posted
6 hours ago, fasstrack said:

Commercial? I played the street today, froze my ass off, made $8. I played my ASS off, and on songs people are supposed to KNOW. Maybe 4 people looked up to even nod acknowledgement in 3 hours. But most have no clue what music is, especially as performed LIVE by experienced, qualified musicians. If it doesn't come out of a digital toy it ain't real to these self-absorbed ignoramuses. Actual music would interrupt their drooling reveries---and piss them off, if they bothered to have ANY reaction. (How can you react to something your parents don't even know about or your equally ignorant 'teachers'?)

Ya gots to realize not many people out there today, especially the young ones, have no idea what it takes to make music. You are preaching to a crowd of people who mostly like hip-hop, rap, and canned pop. Personally, I can appreciate almost any kind of good music. I might now know how to make it, but like the art critic, I know what I like.

  • Like 1
Posted

See I am lucky, I play a lot of music for at the Intellectual Disability centre I work at and they give honest feedback each and every time! This has been fascinating in respect there are a few song that I have trialled, re-trailed then gotten a response that translated directly to then playing the songs live that night.

 

They don't see the older man, they like what they like and it is pretty universal, Abba is still the most requested only just ahead of Country Road, then the next two are originals, BAHHHD Boy and Back to the Future - both songs written around activities at the centre. Don't play these out at open mics often because they work, much rather work on songs which don't.

 

The next song on the hit chart for the singalongs is Swing Low Sweet Chariot, slow chorus and up-tempo verses, it rocks!!! This must be tempered with they also like a lot of the top 40 and the odd strange one, but it is tempo driven I reckon, good solid beats and BAM! Give them a chorus they can sing along with BAM BAM

 

What does this mean, well in my world of being out there playing (pre covid) 3-5 times a week, most performers only play a song list of about 10 songs over the year, one or two songs they sing every or every second week and then the classic songs, such as Aint No Sunshine etc. which come along in movies and are made popular again. Don't need to see the new movie to know that a song is a feature in one of them.

 

What I was finding more than the fact the younger gen don't listen, is firstly sex matters, a good looking girl and the audience remains quiet before and stays attentive unless the level of badness gets to awful, a average looking plump girl, yes and no to this reaction and then as with a young male doesn't have the respect shown but can turn the crowd reasonably easily if they play a catchy song or cover.

 

The better performers generally do well but do notice a proportion of punters who go out of their way to not pay attention if they rate themselves.

 

This I am finding becoming more prevalent month on month regarding attention to others by performers. Sure the genuine ones are still out there but the numbers are dwindling.

 

Do I try and look at the brighter side of life, hell yes, but do accept the soundscape and levels of respect have changed.

 

Older man playing country style story songs, ha, I need to play more covers (or my comedy songs), they aint here for my music!! Still even the occasional person who comes up and asks me who wrote that song or who was that song by makes it worthwhile.

 

 

  • Like 1

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