Modern Mastering

[Nightwolf]

One of the most difficult things I found to learn was knowing when a recording / mix / master was finished...

Well said!! The pros go by when the money runs out

[Prometheus]

It's probably worth entering a little caveat here...

It's very easy to get so caught up in the classic sound engineering arguements, where pop and dance engineers along with heavy metal noise merchants will be compressophilic (like me) and then you get the "old school" who don't trust compressors and new fangled digital technology and then there's the people who like recordings to be dry and natural and others who say, hell, lets make with the flanging and chorusing etc, it is very easy to forget that the rank and file of humanity, as long as they can hear a recording clearly, don't give a damn what the engineer did.

Only other engineers, as long as you don't make a total balls up, are going to scrutinize a mix for an overgated snare or a breathing compressor. I've tried to point these things out to listeners just as an experiment to see if they matter, and even when you demonstrate a problem to people, they either still don't hear it or it just doesn't bother them.

In short, 99.9% of listeners are not likely to venture an opinion that you might have caused a friendly fire incident by being trigger happy with the BBE Sonic Maximizer...

[Nightwolf]

Engineering/recording techniques should by design go unnoticed IMHO.......

[typo]

what about effects? lol

[Prometheus]

Engineering/recording techniques should by design go unnoticed IMHO.......

I would diametrically disagree with that, there would be no point in having mixing engineers at all.... Try listening to Metallica's St Anger and see what a warm and unfatiguing recording you get with no noticable effects... Yiccch!!!!

Also, if everyone worked to that ethos, you'd have no time domain effects like Chorus, Flange, Delay, Reverb, No pumping basslines... Mixes would have no originality and no edge to them...

Edited September 26, 2007 by Prometheus

[john]

Hey

Why constrain yourself either way? Some songs/styles benefit from subtlety, some from a loud statement. Why should effects be any different?

Cheers

John

[Nightwolf]

I agree about St. Anger, that is the worst POS I've heard EVER

I just meant that an engineers manipulations should be smooth, I mean there are times when you want the delay to hit infinity in order to be over the top, but I think for the most part Chorus, Flange, Delay, Reverb and such should be used in a way that sounds natural to the untrained ear.

[Prometheus]

Hey

Why constrain yourself either way? Some songs/styles benefit from subtlety, some from a loud statement. Why should effects be any different?

Cheers

John

Absolutely!

[Prometheus]

I agree about St. Anger, that is the worst POS I've heard EVER

I just meant that an engineers manipulations should be smooth, I mean there are times when you want the delay to hit infinity in order to be over the top, but I think for the most part Chorus, Flange, Delay, Reverb and such should be used in a way that sounds natural to the untrained ear.

The weird thing I've noticed with Chorus is that it sounds more natural when it's not perfect. I used to get the calculator out and work out precise synchronisations so that my chorus effects were all tempo based, but it just didn't sound right without that element of randomness...

[virtua]

I think it is a constant reference. Mixing for the worst set up alone is not the answer.I go back and forward in my mix, a decent speaker switch and also an alternate amp set up that uses the RIAA compensation curve does the job.

It should be remembered that the RIAA compensation curve is there because of the limitations of turntables and vinyl records. There is less and less need for it within the standard home stereo.

for mixdown I would use:

studio amp and monitors

small mono amp and speaker

home stereo

[virtua]

The weird thing I've noticed with Chorus is that it sounds more natural when it's not perfect. I used to get the calculator out and work out precise synchronisations so that my chorus effects were all tempo based, but it just didn't sound right without that element of randomness...

Ttry working out the exact, and then nudge it. It can bring a subtleness to your mix, without the random aspect of "oh it randomly sounded crap" lol

[Prometheus]

Ttry working out the exact, and then nudge it. It can bring a subtleness to your mix, without the random aspect of "oh it randomly sounded crap" lol

Come on old pal, give me some credit. At the risk of sounding immodest, I am a time served craftsman with litterally thousands of recording and mixing sessions under my belt...

I've only ever encoutered one other engineer who even went to the trouble of using algebra and coeffecients to time reverbs, flangers, chorus et cetera, oddly enough it was the engineer that taught me to do it... Most only use algebra for delays, but like me, this guy's a mono maniacal perfectionist...

Rest assured, I don't just turn the chorus unit on at the first preset and say "f*ck It. That'll do." Even laymen in sound engineering parlance can hear whether a chorus effect is adding to or diminishing the mix...

Edited September 30, 2007 by Prometheus