Hagstrom Deuce. Personal Review

[Rudi]

Hagstrom Deuce. (11-Feb-2015)

 

It was always something of a regret that Gibson guitars seemed out of my reach. As a teenager I used to love the look of the SG but always felt the sound was inferior to the Les Paul. But even with Les Pauls I felt restricted by the small fingerboard and that shorter scale Gibsons have.

 

Hagstrom, like nearly every other guitar maker, produce copies of the best favoured designs (ref:  60 Year Old e-Guitars Rule). What’s handy for me is that they make a couple with the neck specs I prefer.

 

In fact the company presently produce no less than 17 models based around the Les Paul (3 x Swedes / 4 x Super Swedes / 2 x Ultra Swedes / 3 x Deuces / 2 x Metropolis / 3 x  Northens).

 

 The Deuces differ from the others in that they are based on the less well known & less popular Double Cutaway models.

 

Link Deuce at Hagstrom Website

http://www.hagstromguitars.eu/index.php?option=com_zoo&task=item&item_id=326&category_id=56&Itemid=36

 

Specifications

• Body: Mahogany with 10mm Carved Maple Top
• Neck: Mahogany, set
• Fingerboard: Resinator™ Fretboard with Hagstrom Pearloid Block Position Marks
• Fretboard Radius: 15
• Trussrod: H-Expander
• Tuning Keys: Hagstrom 18:1 Die Cast
• Scale Length: 25,5“ / 648 mm / Graph Tech™ Black Tusq XL 43mm nut
• Pickups: 2 x Hagstrom Custom 58
• Pickup Selector: 3-Way Toggle 3-Way Toggle Switch
• Bridge: Long Travel Tune-O-Matic w/ Hagstrom Stop Tail
• Controls: 2 x Volume 2 x Tone Push/Pull Tone Knobs (Independent Coil Splits)
• String Gauge (Factory): D'Addario EXP110 (10-46)
• Hagstrom Case: C-51 (Optional)

The page link (above) describes the Deuce as ‘A sibling to our Super Swede, providing ultimate fret access, a multitude of tonal options, and topped off with a classic yet timeless design’.

What they mean is, the ‘Super Swede’ is a conventional Les Paul design whereas the Deuce is the Double Cutaway design.

 

They are also siblings because they share the same scale length of 25.5” (The regular ‘Swede’ & ‘Ultra Swede’ have the conventional Gibson 24.75” scale).

 

Try as I might, no nearby stockist could be found. There are a handful in the North of England and Scotland. Perhaps even they have none, as nowadays web pages advertise stuff they don’t actually have.  It seems no-one likes to keep stock nowadays.

 

To cut a long story short, I decided to take a punt and hope for the best. Further down the page are 3 links to web reviews. I could find no proper ones in English. Oddly Thomann of Germany were cheaper than everybody else. These don’t seem popular models, and I wonder if they may be running down their stock? I placed an order on a Friday afternoon and it was delivered (to my neighbour actually) the following Wednesday.

 

Opening the boxes:

I had ordered both guitar and a hard case from Thomann. They came together in one large box (not with the guitar in the case as expected). My first thought was ‘is the guitar in here? It doesn’t feel heavy enough’. I cut open one end and drew both items out. The guitar was in an additional separate box with polystyrene sections glued to support & protect the guitar. I opened the sealed white jacket containing the guitar and it looked perfect.

 

But I was expecting something heavier and larger. The only independent review I read for the Deuce was for the chambered version, the Deuce F. That review warned that the guitar was a heavyweight at 3.85kg (8.5 lb). So as the regular Deuce is the same shape but solid, I reasoned it would be at least as heavy and probably heavier.

 

In fact a quick (kitchen scales) check shows 3.54kg (7.8lb) for the solid Deuce. Strange.

 

The Deuce is all mahogany like the Gibson on which it’s based. Les Pauls are of course, renowned for heaviness (typically 9-10lb). So the weight came as a pleasant surprise. It’s no doubt due to the more modest body size.

 

It’s certainly not as heavy as my Jacksons, which are maple & alder.

It’s comfortable to hold too, feeling quite natural and evenly balanced.

 

I was immediately glad that I chose the TBS (Tobacco Sun Burst) finish as the black edges show up the cream (5 layer) binding nicely, and the flamed maple surface (this a 0.040” bonded top) looks classy. Thomann had only 3 finishes available. The others being Black or Desert-Haze. Now I see they have no more TSB’s left. It lends credence to the stock shifting theory.

(My 1^st choice would have been Amber Sun Burst if it had been available)

 

It was in tune but only just. It was a tad sharp and the strings immediately slackened when I dashed off a couple of runs. I stretched the strings between my fingers and re-tuned. The D’Addario 10-46’s were fresh on as expected.

 

The neck camber looked about right, perhaps a little straight. I think the luthier I know (Simon) would adjust it for a little more relief. The strings sit a little high at the nut and like most guitars, the Deuce has no zero fret.

 

The neck is very good and better than anticipated. I was a little nervous about the Hagstrom Resinator™ fingerboard. It is a 50/50 wood-epoxies composite, supposedly having the feel and acoustic properties of ebony with improved structural and sonic stability.

 

It also guarantees the elimination of wolf tones, not that I need be much concerned about that with a solid body. It looks more like ebony than the real ebony on my Hofner, showing a close fine grain perpendicular to the frets.

 

The block inlays are perfectly flush with no sign of glue edges. In fact I’m curious as to how this was done. There are usually a few micro-inches mismatch. Not here though. Perhaps they 5-axis machined the blocks already joined in, or at least surface dressed after joining.

The whole neck is an impressive fusion of practicality and ergo design. You can’t just get this feel by dicking about and guesstimating.

 

Of course, I choose the model based on my neck preferences, but I had no idea how well implemented they would be. It could just as easily have felt awkward to use. The neck is the part we see and concentrate on all the time. It’s the most important component on there. The swedes did a really great job with this neck design and the ‘resinator’ fingerboard material is just fine.

 

There is an odd bit of fretwire protruding past the 12^th fret. Not enough to catch my fingers on, and it can only be felt, not seen. It’s a common enough problem with new guitars as the coefficients of expansion of different materials vary when the temperature changes. I shan’t bother to fettle it back myself.

 

This sort of detail, together with surface finish and joining is sometimes part of what separates cheaper guitars from the high end ones. The Deuce is a cheaper guitar made in China. Hagstrom do have a premier range called the Northen (not Northern) which are European made. No I don’t know where, but they do cost more.

 

The frets didn’t feel perfectly smooth when bending strings. A polishing job for Simon in a couple of weeks time.

 

I also had to hand tighten the grommet thread around the pickup selector. Again, no big deal but it’s another detail pointing towards the price point. The guitar certainly was quality checked (it has the quality sticker on), but the inspectors won’t have had the leisure to be as meticulous as those at somewhere like Godin or Rickenbacker.

Bar strings, everything on the Deuce is Hagstrom designed and produced. There’s no 3^rd party hardwear or pickups. There is therefore, an integrity of style throughout. So unless I find something poor, I really wouldn’t want to change any of this.

 

Ok. It took longer for you to read this than it did for me to think of it. I didn’t wait too long to plug it in and see what it could do.

 

What it did

Instead of plugging into the amp I took it to the studio & tried it through the recorder.

I listened to it starkly clean through NFMs. The tonal range is wide, with lots of bottom, most of which will probably be unusable.  I could hear a distinct and massive difference to my other e-guitars.

 

The controls are configured as the regular Les Pauls are. Each pickup has its own volume & tone control bell knobs. These feel a bit cheap but work well enough with no slackness or under/over-travel.

(Earlier Gibson Double Cutaways had just one overall volume & tone control).

 

The tone knobs also double as coil split selectors, by pulling them upward. As expected, the split coil was more pleasing to my ears. The best sound was both pickups working in unison. Something is odd though. The volume controls don’t seem to work consistently at this setting. The neck PU is full on unless turned all the way down at which point it cuts to zero. I have downloaded a PDF of the wiring diagram in case I need to investigate further.

 

After this I cycled through all the BR1600’s tone patches (the same as on the Boss GT6). Some of them actually made sense now, which they seldom did with the Jacksons. That’s not to say they would be usable unmodified. The rockabilly sounds were particularly good. The acoustic ones sounded pretty good too. I even got a half decent jazz tone without trying too hard.

 

The biggest difference was the warm low end tones. This is what I was really hoping for. The big hollow wooden tones were instantly there. I can get this using the neck single coil on the Soloist, but the Deuce has much more bottom end range. The oft publicised Hagstrom sustain was evident too. At the other extreme, the top end is present but with a much narrower range.

 

I am not confident about the various claims made for tone woods. The warmth of the Gibson sound comes partly from the pickups and the shorter scale. The only thing the Deuce has directly in common is the mahogany build. I am now a little more convinced that mahogany forms part of this sound. I hoped it would be.

 

The action was set pretty good. I lowered the treble side of the tune-o-matic bridge a little. The bass end suffered slightly with a little buzzing. The D’Addario strings felt different to the EB Regular Slinkys I normally use, but they are the same gauges I think. I might try an EB Skinny Top Heavy bottom set (10-52). That might suit it better.

 

Accustomed to Jackson brightness as I am, it was easy to overdo the bass thing and fall into the mud. I emerged from the studio after two hours. It would have been longer, but this was a working day for me and I needed to eat & prepare for the morning too.

 

The tonal qualities of this guitar are definitely going to be the most difficult thing to get used to, not the physical guitar itself. The research groundwork took care of much of that anyway.

 

The tailpiece consists of heavy tone blocks through which the strings are threaded. These are seated on Perspex, presumably to protect the wood. The whole sub assembly is covered by a chrome plate which looks as if it was designed as a palm heel rest.

 

I usually pick further toward the neck but decided to give ‘the rest’ a try and pick close to the bridge. It was a lot easier than expected. The strings have far less give at the bridge position but responded pretty well. This of course gave me a bright sound which could be useful given the Deuce’s overall warm disposition. 

The only problem with this is that I was constantly striking the pick up underneath with the pick. Hmmm…

 

The pickups were another unknown. Hagstrom make a point to explain that the whole guitar is considered when determining tone. Matching materials & pickups to achieve a desired sound. In support of this, maybe that why they make so many versions?

 

How much of that is hype and how much truth? I don’t know, but both are in there I’m sure.

 

The pickups used here are Hagstrom Custom 58 Alnico 5 humbuckers, Made in Korea. They are designed for a warm vintage tone.

 

Any downside to the sound? Maybe. I’m not hearing much subtlety to the sounds. It’s hard to pinpoint what this really is. I can control how much of the tone I change, but it’s not rewarding me with anything further. I cannot settle on a ‘sweet spot’ that feels just right.

 

Maybe I need to live with it a while longer. The change in sound from what I’m used to is, after all, massive.

 

So how much like a Les Paul is this thing? I’ve played LPs but never owned one. I suspect that the similarities are mostly superficial. In truth it doesn’t matter too much, but it was a consideration, and seemed like a good way to bookend a review.

 

The Les Paul thing had come about because I had intended buying a pricey Godin instead. That also has a Les Paul styling. That's also an all mahogany construction. They were both pointing back to a common design precedent.

 

What it doesn’t do

I’ve been comparing it to a Gibson Les Paul, a Japanese Jackson Soloist and Godin’s flagship model, the LGX-SA. But the cost of a Deuce averages about £520 in the UK. As usual, USA costs are about 20% less. It’s cheap. Its finish and general attention to detail can’t compare with those guitars.

 

It may transpire that it’s sound cant. But sound is an elusive thing and can’t be 100% relied upon no matter how much you pay. The sound will only be finally evaluated after the Deuce has had its live debut.

 

But its components are good for fit, form and function, its materials are about as good as high ends and its design is excellent.

 

In three months, if I decide that the pickups are a weak point, I’ll take advice from the pickup fellow. He will either modify or replace them. The same applies to the tuners or the wiring. I wouldn’t quite have this confidence with the higher end guitars.

The carcass of the Deuce is worthy. We’ll see about the rest. It’s looking promising so far.

 

Bottom Line

I was lucky three times over.

 

1/ I took a chance on a guitar I had never handled. It paid off. Doing the right research certainly helped.

 

2/ I used a German supplier who saved me 50% of the cost. So it was really cheap. Thank you Thomann.

 

3/ It’s not important but I actually love the look of the thing. The gentle arched top; the rake of the neck; the feminine curved bouts and the flamed maple top. And the handling is only bettered by an even cheaper Charvette I used briefly in the 90s.

 

These are the only proper video reviews I could find (there are a couple more for the Deuce F); none of which are in English. These helped me make the choice.

 

Note: two TSB finishes in the videos have black PU mounting rings. The ones on mine are cream coloured.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K6dPWkexSg AMBER SUNBURST (Spanish)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbtzBeXZ5ng TOBACCO SUNBURST (German)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6tMxsfkoRY TOBACCO SUNBURST (French)

 

 

 

Footnote:

Oddly enough Gibson are making re-issues the Double Cutaway this year as part of the 100^th anniversary. The less expensive ones don’t look quite the same as previous issues, having flat tops and coarse grained finishes. 

 

 

Update: (16-Feb-2015)

I need to confess now that the sound reported earlier was not properly evaluated. The pickups still had the clear plastic surface protectors on (doh!). I haven’t tried it through the BR1600 again but I have tried it using it through the amp (Fender Stage 112 SE) on clean and gain. I also tried it using the Hughes & Kettner Tube Factor and the Line 6 HD POD 400.

 

AMP only. Clean: With Bass, middle & treble all on 25%: More neutral than I had expected. The single coil sounds warranted a tad more mid and another 50% more treble for the neck. These needed retarding slightly using the bridge PU. All sounds produced were clear and even.

 

AMP only. Gain 20%:   Any attempt to raise the Bass or Mids made the sound more difficult to control at the guitar. The treble could be raised all the way to 70% (except for bridge PU only) producing a usable crisp bite. The tones are pleasant and darkly rich.

 

Hughes & Kettner Tube Factor (AMP clean): Disappointing at all settings except at lower levels with 70%  voicing (compression) used. This was a surprise. Picking attack sounded languid.

 

Line 6 HD POD 400 (AMP clean). Used directly between guitar and amp produced reasonable enough tones but somehow produced some uneven string volumes. This was bad. I couldn’t correct this using the digital EQ.

 

When I reconfigured the cabling to use the FX loop (send & return) it all became obedient and even once more. The custom patches took less editing than I thought they would (The Jackson Elite was more bass heavy by far). This setup should sound good live. Looking forward to trying it.

 

I will before then hand the Deuce over to Simon who made such a good job of setting up & fret dressing my Soloist. I will try to remember to re-post at that time.

 

Rudi

Edited February 19, 2015 by Rudi

[Rudi]

I tried it back in the studio again today. It was a little better with the plastic off the pickups.

 

 

Still that one niggle though. Everything works fine but with both pickups selected, the vol & tone controls do not work independently. So this restricts fine adjustment.

 

On Tuesday, I am handing this together with the Hofner Archtop over to Simon the luthier for set ups.

[Rudi]

I collected both the Deuce and the Hofner J17 from Simon the luthier yesterday. The J17 is transformed and the Deuce is much improved. I think SImon checked out the string height spec from Hagstrom. He quoted some to me and I recall something similar from Hagstrom.

 

He certainly cut the nut and re-adjusted the truss rod. He said someone had tried to use it to lower the action. I hadnt touched it. Odd.

Intonation was adjusted I think. Action was lowered a little. Frets look more than polished. I think he radiused them too.

 

I had asked about the pickup tone-vol issue & provided the circuit diagram. Apparently this is one way of configuring them. He said the pickup were potted and didnt seem to be budget ones.

 

I'll have to evaluate that when I get the chance to crank it up. That may be at a jam session of sorts. A drummer has expressed interest in jamming with some of us old guys in Blown Out so we may do just that and see what comes of it.

 

I may have a little more to add about the Deuce in a future blog entry.

[Rudi]

update:

 

I tried out the Deuce at gigging volume on Saturday morning. I brought it out for the last few minutes having done most of the rehearsal with my usual Jackson Soloist.

 

I was also trying out the Line-6 pod 400 signal processor (with the custom tones I had tailored to each guitar). Not an ideal situation to introduce 2 major changes at once, which is why I used the trusty Jackson for all but the last few minutes of the practice/jam.

 

Jackson Soloist: The Line 6 worked out great. The extra volume brought forth more treble than I had expected. I was able to compensate using the guitar tone control. It worked perfectly. The extra ‘gain’ I had anticipated was there and in just the right proportion. No need for any tweaks of any sort.

 

The Hagstrom Deuce: It worked out very well. A little louder & more distorted than the Jackson, so I may go back in (to the Line 6 unit) to back off the gain a little for the dedicated Deuce patch. The main exercise  was to try out the Deuces pickups and they sound absolutely fine & better than expected.

 

My electric guitars are now configured to the Line 6 pod to use the neck pickups exclusively. On the Soloist this a single coil and on the Deuce a split (HB) coil. They both sound excellent. Definitely the best sounds I have ever used.

 

There is still a little work to do on the Deuce. This is the message I sent to Simon the luthier before the practice.

 

Subject: sows ear into silk purse.

 

Hi Simon, Re: Hagstrom Deuce . You did its first set up in February. It’s the least of my guitars but I like it. I’d like to improve it and make it into a reliable gigging guitar.

 

1/ The pickup selector switch worked loose again. Part of the problem was that the cavity was not machined deep enough so there was insufficient thread poking through to engage the nut. So I replaced the washer with a thinner one. This works ok but the switch just feels cheap & nasty.

 

2/ The jack socket also worked loose a couple of weeks ago. I tightened it carefully because I could feel the wiring rotate beneath. I suspect this is also sub-standard.

 

3/ Frets. Although ok. I think they might be improved. A flatness check & fret levelling where required. The artificial fingerboard sound is deceptive though. Acoustically it’s loud and trebly and this accentuates the least bit of fret noise. This is not transmitted through the pickup however, and the notes ring clear when amplified.

 

4/ Pots, capacitor, shielding. Check over & replace if necessary.

5/ I will be trying out the Deuce in a Studio at gigging volume on Saturday. I hope to be able to evaluate the pickups properly then.

 

 

I do think the Deuce will work out fine as a proper working guitar. As originally said, the carcass of the guitar is good. A few mods will improve confidence & reliability.

[TapperMike]

I can't believe I haven't responded to this thread.

 

 

Great Review

[Rudi]

Ok. The Deuce is blooded.

The wedding gig was good and the Deuce was used all the way through without a hitch.

 

The tailor made patches on the Line 6 Pod 400 will need a bit of tweaking. The volume of the 2 chord work ones need raising about 15%.

 

The lead tone sounded more clean than expected and somewhat more twangy too. More so than on the tryout at the rehearsal room mentioned earlier (no I didnt alter anything meanwhile after all). Its as if it has lost a little compression.

 

I went in this morning to sort this out on the Pod. Instead I discovered a combination of Amp & EQ settings that produced a superb jazz tone. It is surprisingly authentic. The weird thing is that the amp selected is categorised as a Metal one. 

 

I may work on the lead tone again tomorrow.

[TapperMike]

I learnt a new word today

blood·ed

ˈblədid/

adjective

 

1. having blood or a temperament of a specified kind.

   "warm-blooded animals"

   • NORTH AMERICAN

     (of horses or cattle) of good pedigree.

     "a blooded stallion"

[Rudi]

Me too.

 

That wasnt what I meant though. Sorry for the confusion Mike.

 

I meant initiated. 

 

When a youngster was first taken out on a hunt, such as a fox hunt. After the kill, they would smear some blood on his face. Pretty barbaric practice. 

[Mahesh]

Very elaborate interview! Thanks Rudi.

 

Wish I could try the Deuce here but we don't see it in India. Looks great!

[Rudi]

Mahesh,

Last time I checked there was only one current stockist here in uk too. Price was quadrupled there.

 

Not even Thomann have any now either.

[Rudi]

Finally after 5 and a 1/2 months I have the Deuce back from luthier.

He's a great luthier but hell, have I missed that guitar.

So it now has USA switchcraft switch and jack socket. I asked him to look for a few more thou action improvement. He did some fret levelling and found them. It played well before, but its even better now,

The biggest change is in controls. The push pull control (coil taps) has been removed. Two of the knobs now operate the coil splits. One for each pup.

The remaining 2 knobs are now master vol & master tone. A much better arrangement than the former Gibson style circuit.

God it sounds good!

 

[TapperMike]

Finally huh.

Starting on Gibson type tone/pot controls I was very content until I got my strat. I like the one volume does it all. and I've had the one v/one t systems and I find them fine.  

I can imagine that push/pull top hats (gibson style) pots would be a pain.

[Rudi]

I didnt mind the push-pulls so much as the independent vol & tone knobs.

This became a problem at the Jazz Band debut gig, whenever I was trying to turn volume down using the wrong knob on the Coupe.

It was Simon that suggested that the push pulls might not 'last' as long as a dedicated switch/knob control.

I called titled our e-mails 'pigs ear to silk purse'. He kept the guitar so long I wondered if he'd had an accident & didnt want to tell me!