Scales, Keys, Modes

[neil p]

So ive been playing for a lil while, like 4 years, however im all self taught (not by choice). So i was curios how most of you guys approach scales and key changes. i know my way around music theory, at least the basics so dont feel the need to dumb stuff down.

anyways, when i play i dont shift the scale up or down. i just play the scale in the same key up and down the neck. so i know all the modes, just cant call on any specific one at any given time. soo i guess what im wondering is just how you guys put the two to use. do you guys mostly focus on a mode then shift it to a different key, or just apeshit on a scale shred in one key up n down the neck (how ive been playing ). dont get me wrong i like running up a scale, but want more out of my playing.

so just how do you guys approach, and blend these together while playing? thx

quick lil side Q while your here. when you play do you look at the fret board or dots on the side of neck? thx X2

Edited November 14, 2012 by neil p

[TapperMike]

There are several bodies of thought on this one. And oddly two such methods share the same name though exhibit different functionalists. This is the case of "Modality"

In jazz especially modern, fusion, Bebop (although there are some vast differences within the bebop movement) and "smooth"

You are moving thru key changes rather quickly. Not only key changes but the melody has a direct line in with the harmony. It's moving so fast that many simply concentrate on the harmonic motion (arpeggios) to derive a melodic or solo line from. often times players will use neighboring or passing tones to connect the dots.

When you first start out you have to first define your chord tones. It's a very very boring exercise. Play only one chord tone per relavant chord/measure. Next think about how you are going to get to that tone by it's nearest neighboring tone either above it or below it. A neighboring tone doesn't have to be a scale/key tone. Put that neighboring tone on or after the four (the fourth beat of the measure that precedes the the chord tone you are aiming for. Again it's a boring exersize but it puts your fingers and mind in play for what is to follow.

In jazz a great time is spent on working out not where you are but where you are going. For the melodic and solo performance much emphasis is placed on the 3rd and the 7th of the chord. These are called "Guide tones" In the bass it is usually consigned in moving to the root of the next chord. This is what separates a good jazz walking bassline from your average rock/blues walking bassline.

I did an article on jazz walking basslines here - http://www.tappermike.com/?q=node/4

I tried not to spice it up as much as I do in regular playing so as in hopes that once you've mastered the basics of movement you be able to add little bits. The important thing is it's reduced to four notes per measure so you can work out connecting the dots.

There are literally thousands of youtube videos on creating melodies using the 3rd and the 7th as guide tones. The important thing to walk away with is focusing your energy on playing where you are but moving to the next chord and being on top of it when it lands.

Now your not going to get it if you jump to the chase and don't work out the supporting chord movement.

Notice how during the very end of that she uses lead in tones for the bassline while playing the rhythm. Not as advanced as my bass line lesson but my lesson introduces this concept of a lead in to a chord tone.

Now this is where she gets into it.

There are situations where I wouldn't use that approach. or I would use it to limited capacity. But you can't use that approach unless you are willing to work it thru with those types of changes then....There is absolutely no point in trying that type of "Modal" playing.

The second type of modal playing involves building a progression from the mode. Contrary to perceptions held elsewhere BB King likes referencing the mixolydian scale more so then the blues scale, or both common pentatonics (minor and major). Although he and almost every blues guitarist on planet earth to follow the chord changes for the turn around.

Modulation is when/where a key change occurs. Key changes can be slight and then return or or the key change can be affixed to the progression. When you have these types of modulated progressions like...Overkill by men at work.

The verse chord progression

Goes_

{D ] A [ C } G]

The chords are "smart voicings with a decending bass.

The lowest notes played in the chord go..

|D | D# | C | B ]

These are all major chords. and you have two possible keys. D and G both contain three of the chords. No key contains all the chords as expressed.

The simple solution is to modulate. Group your first two measures into the key of D because that is a 1-5 progression and group your second pair of chords into the key of C because that can be treated as a 1-V as well. You can couple your licks. Such as playing a line for the first two measures then transpose it down and repeat it or you can transition between the two.What makes it happen is your timing and approach. If you are fighting it then it will fight back.

In a progression like the above it usually has to resolve to something and stay there at the end, Or move to a more "stable progression. Such as a vamp (a progression that has only one chord)

Now lets talk about consonance and dissonance. Consonance means the notes you are playing are inline with the chord. Dissonance means when when a note you are playing is not inline with a chord. Dissonance means your note is not jiving with the chord. There are degrees of dissonance and notes are in motion. A very common practice especially in the blues is to move from connosance to dissonance and back again. If you listen to ...Eric Clapton playing the blues. When you play the blues you move harmonically from the I chord to the IV then back to the I Chord before the turn around. He has applied resolution by merit that the chord moves back to a stable state.. During the turnaround he uses the tried and true method of supporting the chord changes. But the turn around is not the same as the rest of the progression.

There are several methods. Methods work by circumstance. Some methods crossover and can be applied to different styles while others not so much. Before blindly chasing an ideal and trying to apply it in an out of context setting you have to master the concept within the framework it was developed for. Some concepts like tritone substitution.simply don't work out of context.

Now I've been a rock guy. Been in paying rock bands both covers and originals. Done session work as a rock player. I've been a jazz guy, Played in jazz bands recorded accompaniment parts for jazz performers even did session work on commercial jingles with a jazz vibe, and I'm a Blues man. played blues guitar in a blues band and held blues jams where everyone stares at your hands and thinks they can do it better then you whether they can or not. Those are the gigs I got the most standing ovations for.

My point is this. Unless you have a willing desire to explore the medium then the methods are not going to do you any good. When I was playing rock I was all about rock. I played rock in context. many of the things I knew from the jazz and blues world did not apply. Same story with my jazz and blues experiences. When they don't apply there is nothing that will make them apply.

There was a time when Carlos Santana was the king of the dorian mode. Evil Ways, Black Magic Woman, Samba Pa Ti, His cover of She's not there by the zombies. I was a huge fan of his as an aspiring guitarist. He played with so much gut wrenching soul and conviction. He felt trapped by his musical direction. He wanted to play more like his idol....Count Basie. He tried and failed and tried and failed and tried some more and failed some more. Then Wayne Shorter sat him down and spelled out the basics of jazz and said to him you can want all you want but it's not going to make a hill of beans worth a difference until you embrace the medium. Your blues rock progressions aren't going to work if you try to apply jazz sensibilites to your playing and your dorian/blues licks aren't going to work in a jazz context. Santana listened. and even though he still sounded for the most part like Santana afterwards he embraced the context not just the methodology behind the context. Once he accepted the path and embraced it he could then re introduce his other rock sensibilities but not before.

[TapperMike]

I'll be perfectly frank about this. When I first learned to play the guitar I was introduced to three chords and two basic rhythm patterns. That's all my friends ever showed to me. I would buy books on guitar and music in general and I could spout theory like no one's business and thought of my self as okay. I was a respected rhythm guitarist but I knew that I was lacking in other areas. For all my efforts in trying to get better by reading I wasn't getting any better.

I went thru a teacher who all he wanted to do is show me licks to a teacher who knew I expected more then a few licks. I learned and was applying more in less then three months studying under a good teacher then the previous 4 years prior when I was trying to figure it out by myself. I moved from being a guy who could play a few songs backing someone up to being a self actualized guitarist. Better gigs bigger venues better bands. Even sitting around the house jamming to whatever I was better because of the first hand education I got.

You are never too old to start taking lessons and if you've never had the benefit of a good teacher then you'll never be able to realize your full potential.

[pboaz]

TapperMike -- good stuff!

[LayneGreene]

Thumbs up TapperMike, great post

[neil p]

I'll be perfectly frank about this. When I first learned to play the guitar I was introduced to three chords and two basic rhythm patterns. That's all my friends ever showed to me. I would buy books on guitar and music in general and I could spout theory like no one's business and thought of my self as okay. I was a respected rhythm guitarist but I knew that I was lacking in other areas. For all my efforts in trying to get better by reading I wasn't getting any better.

I went thru a teacher who all he wanted to do is show me licks to a teacher who knew I expected more then a few licks. I learned and was applying more in less then three months studying under a good teacher then the previous 4 years prior when I was trying to figure it out by myself. I moved from being a guy who could play a few songs backing someone up to being a self actualized guitarist. Better gigs bigger venues better bands. Even sitting around the house jamming to whatever I was better because of the first hand education I got.

You are never too old to start taking lessons and if you've never had the benefit of a good teacher then you'll never be able to realize your full potential.

thank you i really appreciate the time you spent on this, ill read the information you posted a bit later. I see what your saying, ill be getting a job soon enough but have limited funds (tho if it comes to it i will gladly get lessons). I will be attending a community college and they have a guitar theory class im going to take. I figured id just bug the teacher there. however im hoping to just be able to get a good practice scheduled for myself.

[neil p]

all you need is the desire to learn & the personal discipline to put what you've learned into practice.

ya the personal discipline for shure