Benefits Of Critiquing

[john]

Hey

Ok, I guess most members now get that I think critiquing the work of others is an important part of developing as a songwriter. But, obviously, not everyone thinks that way. So I thought it would be interesting, and would perhaps encourage folks who don't bother much with reviewing, if you guys could share what you feel you get from critiquing.

If you think there are drawbacks, by all means mention them to. I doubt there will be many!

Cheers

John

[nigel lawry]

Hey

Ok, I guess most members now get that I think critiquing the work of others is an important part of developing as a songwriter. But, obviously, not everyone thinks that way. So I thought it would be interesting, and would perhaps encourage folks who don't bother much with reviewing, if you guys could share what you feel you get from critiquing.

If you think there are drawbacks, by all means mention them to. I doubt there will be many!

Cheers

John

As far as writing (like anything), it's just a learning process, the more we study good sources, practice, work at it, the better we get... pretty simple really, and that applies to everyone.

And whether it's just inexperience or we have a bad day, we all blow it... it just happens less often the more experience we get.

the only draw back is trying to be open and honest when critiquing,without upsetting the writer

[saran]

Hello John,

I can't help people like you can because I don't have that experience but I'm happy to read other peoples work/comments and spend more time doing just that because there are so many talented people here that can teach me something. I just don't think that what I have to say would be helpful to a lot of members. Though I still think that it's important to say something and learn how to comment in a helpful way!

You can blow me away now with one of your comments if you like.

[john]

You can blow me away now with one of your comments if you like.

C'est moi? Should I add horns to my avatar? Hmmmm...

ok then

I've been playing the guitar for a long time, but I can still learn from guitarists that have only benn playing 6 months. Why? Lots of reasons. Each brings to the table a host of experiences and skills they had before they started to play. Each brings their own perspective on the guitar, fuelled by their interests and possibly other guitarists or other musicians that they play with. Each has their own creative skills. Each has their own level of dexterity. Each has their own "ear" for music. Each has their own taste in music. Each has had a unique exposure to different music genres. Each has their own aspirations. I could go on, but I'm sure it's getting boring.

Lyricists and songwriters are the same.

No, sorry, got to go on

As far as the validity of your reviews, as long as you explain your reasoning and offer suggestions it does help other writers. If for no other reason than it exposes your perspective, and makes them look at their lyric from that perspective.

Ok purely technically I can understand why you would feel like holding back, but even then your observations do not need to be deeply technical. Even reporting what you observe and asking questions can help the writer, as well as you.

I've taught the guitar before, and worked with musicians of all levels of skill and interest level. Virtually all feel intimidated at some point. As a teacher trying to answer you have to be clear. To explain, you have to first understand. So, as a writer, if someone asks a question and I can't explain, I re-examine my lyric. I seek to understand.

I recently wrote (and posted) a couple of lyrics. I was discussing one of the lyrics (Always on my mind) with one of the mods. I asked if they wanted my explanation for the lyric. They said yes, and I proceeded to discuss the theme(s), how they inter-related, how ambiguity worked within the lyric, dynamics, form, the reason for every single line, and every single word. They were shocked at the detail level I go to.

I try and work a lyric, and I do that by anticipating questions. That starts with observation, opinion, and perspective. It also means the ability to shift your perspective, which change the observations and ultimately my opinion. Getting feedback from non-musos, non-lyricists is also valid. Ok, I expect something different, but I still generally gain from their observations.

The point is, the technical side is only 1 aspect of review, so don't get hung up on it.

Cheers

John

*puts soapbox away quietly hoping no one noticed.

[Lazz]

Songstuff critique

I think critiquing the work of others is an important part of developing as a songwriter.

....... share what you feel you get from critiquing.

I agree whole-heartedly

For me, being able to critique the work of others educates me about how to improve my own. My personal creative development, such as it is, rests pretty much entirely I reckon on appreciation and analysis of the work of others – identifying exactly what it is I like, what it is that works so well, and how they pull it off.

I have heard people suggest that too much study of others’ work constitutes an influence they would wish to avoid because it leads to becoming a copy-cat. But how else do we study and learn learn craft other than by attempting to emulate those we admire ? No-one comes fully-fledged to a tradition. Critique is as essential as it is unavoidable.

What I get from performing critique is a constant sharpening of the tools for critiquing my own work and polishing ‘til it’s as brilliant as I can make it.

[Steve]

I think there are some who would perhaps like to critique more, but find it difficult to express in words, what they may feel about a particular piece of work! Myself included. I have read lyrics and listened to music and have sat poised to respond, only to falter at how to describe my feelings for that particular piece of work! Or sometimes, I may feel like responding only to find that others have responded in a similar vein to the line I would have taken, thus rendering any critique I may have, completely void! After all, we're not all great writers!

[saran]

John,

OK, I get your point and those of Nigel, Lazz and Steve, and all I can say is.....I'm on a mission!

Thanks you lot!

[Steve]

'm on a mission!

Impossible.

[DeadSkinny]

If your song has a weak spot (or two or three) why wouldn't you want someone to point it out? O.k., i'll admit, it's kindof a sting in the pride sometimes, but it can only make it better in the end. Maybe you don't have to follow each critique word for word and do exactly what the other writer suggests ( although a lot of the advice that i've recieved here have been right on the money), but it gets you thinking about, perhaps, other ways to improve the song. I mean hey, if i notice you've got a tire on your car that's almost flat, wouldn't you want me to tell you about it before you drive off to work and get stranded? You wouldn't want me to keep quiet just because you "patched that tire yourself, and did a perfect job". A large chunk (a majority perhaps) of the hit songs out of Nashville are written by two or more people. The more input, the better in many cases. We all intend to write music that other people will love, so it makes sence to tell people what you think about their songs and vice versa.

Think about how much time and money a big company spends on market research and testing before a new product is put on the shelves? These are the top people in their fields, genieus's at building amazing products that the rest of us can't concieve of doing, and they want to know what "we" think every step of the way! Why, because it makes it better.

-joel