john

Hi and welcome to Songstuff Sidster!

Hi David, thanks for the compliment. Long time no see. How are you?

Hey I have attached a poll. It would be really helpful to get some answers so that we can set our development focus so that we best help you beyond a place to hang out, give and get critique and talk about making music. So I would appreciate it if you would take some time, give it some thought and answer all the questions! Cheers John

You’re not alone in feeling that void. A fan base doesn’t just happen. They are built. Most artists are in that position because they haven’t paid much attention to fan base building. They tend to follow a philosophy of “record it and they will come” and that doesn’t work. Where there are a very few artists who feel that strategy has worked for them, generally someone else, or someones else, has built it for them. I guess the point is, achieving this is a learned skill. Work at it and you will get better and better. Most musicians I know can learn to sing. They might not be destined for vocal glory, but they can usually learn to sing sufficiently. Like music marketing, it is a skill you have to work at. It’s amazing how a few uncorrected errors in technique can sabotage the end result!

Going to a Go-Go - Smokey Robinson and the Miracles

Hi Martial Sorry, I’ve been really busy this last few weeks. It’s a huge topic area. There are several sites that offer free release plans but in my experience they are very basic and relate more to the functional steps that dovetail with their products. Most are cookie-cut plans but realistically there are many factors when it come to effective plans. Starting point plans are only useful for simple, early stage plans, unless they are backed up with a load of info, tools and time. We do have quite detailed release plans, particularly for the pre-release phase, but the details are contained in our own upcoming products. We have been thinking about a free version but as it would be simpler and of limited use, it hasn’t been our highest priority. That said, we are a friendly bunch and where we can help, we will try to. Perhaps you can share what your current plan is and we can go from there? Cheers John

Hey Brooks, welcome to Songstuff! So what is your plan? EP? Album? Keep releasing stuff you are proud of? Something else?

Ballerina Valerie - Joni Mitchell

To get the ball rolling here are my photos. I’ll update this post with my gear list later.

Hi Gang What does your studio look like in 2022? If you can, a hardware and software list is good, plus photos for some bonus points! Cheers John

Hi and welcome to Songstuff Riff! What, if anything, do you hope to achieve with your music?

Some awesome solos going on there. I just love the bass groove.

There are quite a lot of members like you. Just not pinged by VX. It’s not even an age and experience thing. We have quite a lot of older experienced members, but it is about what people want to do next… and some people younger and still early in their musical life have the same ambition that you do. My point is we have a load of resources and people, so don’t feel you are on your own.

You are very welcome! My thought is that, for those interested in exploring a way forward, that we…… oh the suspense!

Perfect!

Essentially, the same approximate strategy and tactics can be used free or paid… though some are very limited. For example, we might have an advertising strategy that can to a degree be realised using free social posts and forum posts… but the tactics would be different and more expansive if you have available budget. That is life! Still, the same principles apply to both. Can anyone answer any of these?

Hi Based on a conversation earlier on about goals and member opinion, I thought a few polls was a pretty good suggestion, right in line with my own thoughts. So…. Please have a read, have a think and respond! We are not mind readers, and your opinions do matter, a great deal! Cheers John

I will post some more, but it’s late and I have to move! Lol

I like the essential core idea you put forward @VoiceEx. To me it’s a partnership. There is a level of partnership with the members we directly work with but there is also a partnership between the site and all members. I will address the general partnership between all active members and Songstuff outside of this topic. Essentially we work together. In fact I would go beyond Songstuff and individual members working together, although that needs to happen. As a group, participating members and Songstuff staff, need to work together. We want members to achieve their goals. We want you to be happy with achievements and to be impressed. We want you to gain confidence and to establish good working practices. We want you to realise your potential… whatever that is. We also want you to have realistic expectations. This is not about dreams and snake oil. This is not about Songstuff waving a magic wand If you are content with where you are at, great. This is not for you. If you are willing to try, if you are willing to work to improve the current response your music releases, then let’s talk. One thing I will mention, @VoiceEx you said about this not costing a penny (in terms of the Artist budget)… that depends entirely upon your personal goals. If you have more aggressive goals and shorter timescales…. doing it without spending a penny on your promotion might not be possible. Absolutely. I didn’t take it that way. Not even remotely.

Hey An interesting development of the topic and not wholly too far away from the entire reason for the topic. I wanted to see if there is any interest and then discuss plans and goals... being the first step in helping people. There's a lot here to come back to, some of which goes along with my thinking, others which there are options about. I find this interesting. I'd be interested to know how and why? The site hasn't changed its attitude in that regard for more than 20 years. We have always had a mix of pro & amateur and almost entirely "indie". The header says "Supporting Independent Music". Elsewhere on the site, it says "supporting independent music since 2000". Non-indies are welcome, but they are a teeny-tiny minority. Indie just means "independent". You can be a full pro indie. You can be signed to a major (not indie) and be getting state benefits (amateur). You can be a full pro & DIY. You can be semi-pro and not DIY. The two things just don't go hand in hand. Add to that, musicians, artists, songwriters are often in flux. On the way up they typically become increasingly pro and sometimes non-DIY and sometimes they stay DIY, on the way down they become increasingly less successful... some become amateur musicians, some always stay semi-pro and some stay pro. Often they become more DIY as budgets shrink. What we offer in terms of features (boards, articles, topics) is not unusual in either environment. In terms of supporting members, it's the same fundamentals (like critique boards and discussion boards) as it ever was. In terms of helping indie amateurs and indie pros.... it is almost identical. The primary difference is the viability of making money from their music. If they want anything... both want more listeners. Both want more fans. I don't really see there being any difference, because it is a sliding line. For example, we almost all start at being full-time employed doing something else and amateur home players. As soon as you accept money for a gig you are effectively semi-pro As soon as you accept money for a download? semi-pro. If you accept money for anything relating to your music... Semi-pro. At some point your income might totally come from music, or at least your living expenses are covered. At that point, you are effectively a pro. You can have one or many income streams, it makes no difference. So.... Songstuff has an identity crisis? Well, we have to support DIY. The site is covered in DIY stuff. Currently, we offer zero pro services. We don't point people at pro services. What do we do? We encourage people who want more fans, want more listeners etc, to get more fans, get more listeners. If you want to grow past a certain point it takes some expenditure. If you want to cover that out of your pocket, that is fine. If you want to recoup it from your music, then you need to put stuff in place to make that happen. Do any of our regulars see it as an identity crisis? No one has ever said this to me. If they had I would have asked them why they felt that way? It's a crisis that doesn't make any sense. So here in a nutshell is the mission: Are you a songwriter, musician, artist or producer? Would you like to improve your music? Then we can help. Would you like to improve what you can do with your music once it is recorded? Then we can help. Do we cater to independent musicians? Yes. Absolutely. Do we cater to DIY musicians? Yes. Absolutely. Do we cater to pro musicians? Yes. They need very similar things to amateurs. Do we cater to Major artists? Yes... at least you can do many aspects of being an artist here that are common to majors, indies, amateurs, and pros. We don't offer any major-level pro services at this time. Honestly, for the members saying this (and I can't imagine there are many... though the few may have loud voices, I don't know, I haven't heard them!) I would say point me to the source of your confusion and I can clear it right up.

Hi As a songwriter, what are your options? What can YOU do with YOUR songs? For example... what is your plan (or was) for approaching music publishers? What is your plans for demos? Do you plan to release songs as an artist? What about end goals? Do you want other artists to perform your songs? Do you plan to release an original and then pitch the song? Do you intend going after production companies as your main priority? Although I started this topic here for general discussion, if anyone wants to explore their options, plans and tactics, we can perhaps start individual topics and workshop your plans? It has to be better than working on them on your own. It's a good chance to sanity check your music plan. Cheers John

Hey Liv! Great to meet you! Welcome to Songstuff! Hopefully we can help you on your journey. What sort of artists are your musical heroes? Who would be your influences? Cheers John

Audio tracks? MIDI loops? You could look at Ardour, LMMS or Rosegarden. I am familiar with Linux but haven’t really used it for music production so I can’t really offer any opinion based on experience.

It looks like John Paul Jones, Led Zep bassist