Internet Promotion Vs Playing Live

[jramm]

So, there is a big thread on online promotion and I was wondering what people on here think about the 'traditional' of playing live and building up a fanbase this way and its place today? How important is regular playing to bands and how should they go about it? Is it even a good idea to rely only on this method these days? Or conversely (and this is what I think) is internet promotion pretty useless without live gigs to back it up?

I'll give 2 examples for both sides of the board.

1. Pomplamoose. If you don't know them they are a band who came to prominence last year through their youtube videos. They record everything at home and make innovative videos to go with it. They sold 100 000 downloads alone last year. Pretty good as they don't have any label, management, etc to share it with!

2. Fleet Foxes. I'm sure you have probably heard of them, came to prominence in 2008, but didn't even get a .com website until the release of their 2nd album this year. In fact for a long while they only had a myspace with a small number of songs that never changed (they had myspace take their page down this year), there was already a huge buzz around them when they released their ep Sun Giant before their debut. Their first album is platinum in the UK and the 2nd debuted at no 2 in the uk.

So, pomplamoose - all internet promotion and the biggest band I can think of who have relied on only that. Fleet foxes are the biggest band I could think of that did it mostly without self-promotion on the internet.

I sit on the fence that to get a deal, a lasting fan-base etc, then playing live and promoting your ep that way is the optimum method of filling up that fan list! I think it takes a certain kind of music to succeed purely on the internet - light hearted, a bit comic perhaps and fun? The kind of music with videos that you would link to your friend. I find that I don't often mention more 'serious' music to friends unless I've seen them live or heard the e.p/album

What do you guys think? How many of you are playing live regularly?

[JamTimeMusic]

Cool post Jramm,

I think you raise a very valid debate and I found your information very interesting. Especially that I didn't realise Pomplamoose had a good amount of success despite being unsigned. The unsigned bit doesn't surprise me as I think they are a bit odd but clearly there are 1% of their viewers who are willing to buy their tracks. When you regularly get millions of views your chances of sales are good. They have been very clever.

I think the answer is clear to me. Do both if you have time.

My personal preference would be internet first because it's a massive platform for exposure. Gigging is a hard slog and requires a lot of hard work and sacrifices that you cannot always make in a real world! But of course is very rewarding.

Great subject. Looking forward to other responses.

JD

[jramm]

Yeah, pomplamoose are a little odd, but I think thats why it has become an internet success. You mention that internet would be your preference as it is a massive platform for exposure, but to me this has massive difficulties in itself. Sure, there are millions of people on the net, but how would they ever get to your website unless they are aiming to get there? Just putting up a site may cause only your friends to have a look. By doing a gig, at the worst you would play only to your friends, but crucially also to the people that have come to see the other bands, the promoters, barman, sound guy etc. All ready a better base for getting the word out...

[JamTimeMusic]

I totally accept your thoughts on the gigging scene BUT you could do exactly the same on the internet by being interesting and working hard to make sure people are watching/listening.

The crux comes down to hard work BUT,

I think internet should be the primary because it will only reinforce what you do at gigs. Ideally really you should do both but you need all the marketting in place before you do the gigging IMO.

When i say internet I mean You Tube as a primary, facebook to advertise and a website as a minimum. You also really need a product E.g. album or single that is available to purchase.

If you have those sites with a decent few videos you can then gig like mad and make the two compliment each other.

So, although the debate is which one, I would say both but, internet first so that you have the reinforcing product in place. Any good business man will tell you: A product that sells while you are sleeping is the forefront to becoming rich/successful.

So in short the steps you should take in this order are:

1) Product production

2) Marketing via internet

3) Marketing via public display

JD

[john]

Hi

I don't play gigs anymore, not through choice I might add, but I played hundred and hundreds of gigs in my time.

I really don't think this is an either / or situation. There are two primary motivators for playing gigs. One artistic in nature and the other business in nature (from the perspective of the band).

Gigs, real world or virtual, are about promotion. They create spikes of interest but they also serve to underline the musicality and performance aspects of the band. Recordings on the other hand promote an idealistic view. Gigs have more of a short term effect in terms of promotion. Recordings also create spikes of interst, but they tend to have more longevity. Recording can be picked up and played at any point, you canot say thesame about gigs. that is why live performance and recordinngs go so well together in terms of promotion, They are complimentary..

Looking at internet promotion, it reaches a wider audience, or has the potential to fo so.That is a good and bad thing. You can be prtty popular on the interet ut still strugglr to fill a small venue.

Gigs on the other hand have a far more localised effect, and likewsie you could be popular locally and almost non-existant on the web.

This is why real and virtual world compliment each other,

For me rhis then become an argument between building your presnce over wide area or over a local area, global chart or local chart. Both have their benefits. The thing is there is absolutely nothing to stop you doing both, in fact it is recommended. A spike of interest in one can have a benefit in the other. These days you cannot afford to not do both. I don't perform for reasons beyond my control

Building a band locally is certainly much easier. But bands need to reach beyond the local level. The internet slots in there adding in a stepping stone.

I think the priority is all of them and don't leave the marketing until the end. This is after all a business too...

Cheers

John

[neoism]

Just to add a bit since i am now officially in social media business for artists and bands.

Now a days when internet have become a major part of daily life and it plays an important role in the music business as well. Very simple and famous example : Rebecca Black. She is now famous among all lame teens all because of internet. Her video got major amount of dislikes due its LAME-NESS. Yet she has become rich and famous just because of social media. and there are lot of talented people also around globe, which wouldn't have come to light if youtube never existed.

I am basically from India and the band and independent music scene is still in the pre-historic age. And the bands get the gigs and tour through internet promotion only. It's a fact that so many good bands came into lime light just because of that. If you know about a movie "the rocker". What they've shown is the power of social media only.

Prayag

[beatpoet]

I guess it depends what kind of music you play. Pop stuff like Lady Gaga and Justin Bieber will always do well on the internet because it's all tied in to Twitter and YouTube. A regular guitar band will need to do something incredibly gimmicky to get the same amount of attention. Kings Of Leon had to sell out and become a poppy boyband to achieve a greater level of success, but even they didn't reach the heights of Lady Gaga.

At a grassroots level, based on my own experiences, you can play gigs for years and never get anywhere. It's hard to even start playing actual music venues (places where people exclusively go to watch bands, not pubs or backrooms) without any representation. A booking agent will get you gigs that are "closed off" to regular unsigned bands, but unless you are willing sink all your money into your band and give up your job to tour full time and sleep on floors, it's very hard to get anywhere by just doing gigs. I joined a band with a booking agent in London and while we did tour, we would have needed to go on the road full time to make the next step to increasing our profile (the band had been doing well before I joined, with Radio 1 sessions, NME coverage and TV spots). Added to that, London is supposed to be the music mecca of the UK ("London was calling!" they say), but you could do a year of gigs there and never get noticed. The standard of small gigs there isn't any higher there than anywhere else in the UK - if anything, it's lower, and that was a bit of an awakening.

I'd add the Joy Formidable in as a band that have broken through by relentlessly touring. They've been touring non-stop since mid-2008, when they put out the first EP. Their debut album only came out in January this year, and they've just kept going round and round and round. They've already done more US tours than you can count on two hands. People appreciate how hard they work and it's reflected in their presentation and performance.

[Tambarskjelve]

I believe it is also a question why you are in it. For the money? For the fun? Or for both? For myself personally, there is nothing more satisfying than performing my own music with a red hot band in front of people. I will bring my music to the people that way, even if I have to pay for it. So it`s obvius, I`m in it for the fun.....

Edited December 12, 2011 by Tambarskjelve

[farouk2music]

I'm just making my own songs for fun, but I abosolutely have no time to actually get out and gig (except maybe at a random talent show at my college); I'm doing Pre-med as of now in school. Because of that, I solely have to rely on the Internet to promote what I do. I'm in the process of getting my material out there In due time, and I don't really mind if I get a HUGE following, but I'd like to have enough.

That being said, I have to learn how to utilize internet promotion to the max, even if it's only for a short while.