New Music Friday, Critique, Copyright and Risk

[GregB]

I've never entered 'New Music Friday' before as personal experience indicates that most listeners, even past collaborators, cannot find the merit in anything other than something  which is already 90% complete, even if you explain in detail things like: chorus to come, basic mix only, I will speed up or transpose, other instruments to be added, etc. etc.

 

So (and I'm genuinely interested in your philosophy rather than being 'ornery):

• why not just wait until it's done and as a final review stage prior to release
• this more advanced level of recorded completeness also protects your copyright (people can't help but be influenced by everything they hear)
• why post here rather than the several 'critique' areas

Cheers,

Greg

[john]

2 minutes ago, GregB said:

I've never entered 'New Music Friday' before as personal experience indicates that most listeners, even past collaborators, cannot find the merit in anything other than something  which is already 90% complete, even if you explain in detail things like: chorus to come, basic mix only, I will speed up or transpose, other instruments to be added, etc. etc.

 

So (and I'm genuinely interested in your philosophy rather than being 'ornery):

• why not just wait until it's done and as a final review stage prior to release
• this more advanced level of recorded completeness also protects your copyright (people can't help but be influenced by everything they hear)
• why post here rather than the several 'critique' areas

Cheers,

Greg

It would still be protected in copyright terms. Copyright exists as soon as it is created. Add to that your post here is time stamped but realistically only accessed by a relatively small number of people. In my case, my audio is also converted into video (time stamped) and uploaded to YouTube (time stamped). My lyrics are stored in the cloud in documents with version history turned on. When it comes to proving I had the earliest access with a provable development…. I am pretty covered.

 

A more advanced level of recorded completeness protects your copyright? Where did you hear that? Every version has copyright. Protection comes from proof of earliest possession and a provable evolution/version history. The more ways you have of demonstrating prior access to something, the stronger your copyright protection. Copyright of a specific version of a song depends on the recording of that version. So say I write a song that is a single verse plus chorus. Copyright exists as soon as it is committed to a recording. Ok, copyright exists on written lyrics and written out music too, which can exist before the recording, though copyright on the combination of lyrics + music exists at the moment they are committed to a medium together. For someone to build upon that song legally (writing wise), it needs the permission of the original writer to do so. The original writer can create new derivative works any time. In the USA they can do a cover once a public version has been released, though they would need to acknowledge the copyright and pay the songwriter the appropriate license fee, the same as any song.

 

Better recordings don’t protect better. Proof protects better.

Proof doesn’t stop people stealing your work

In the grand scheme of things a release downloaded by 500 people is no better protected than a song posted here.

If someone rips off one of my drafts, it is still built on my draft. If they can rip it off in a way that the similarity couldn’t be demonstrated, then they could just as easily rip off the finished version.

 

True, in the USA currently, registration affords you better compensation in terms of damages. If the artist made enough to make damages worthwhile I would probably have benefited more from publicity (and they lost more due to the same issue).

 

PS. This topic is in a critique area!

 

Over the years there have been a very, very small number of songs ripped off that were posted on this forum. In every case I have been aware of I have helped the writer/artist in question by contacting music sites publishing the copyright violating work and the offending work has been taken down. Often  the site owners (Soundcloud, Google, Apple, Spotify etc) will suspend or ban the offending artist. Google will also stop that artist’s version and pages that contain it from being indexed by search engines. The result being their rip-off version goes nowhere and often the offending artist’s career is often damaged, if not over.

 

Two types of such copyright theft I have seen online have involved ill-informed and immature writers passing the work of others as their own, based upon a flawed understanding of the term “fair use” and “freely available”, and disgruntled collaborating partners. Even registered copyright would not prevent such idiots from trying to steal your song. People who know better aren’t usually that stupid.

[GregB]

1 hour ago, john said:

A more advanced level of recorded completeness protects your copyright? Where did you hear that?

 

Hi John.

 

Alas, as usual I didn't properly convey my thoughts ... and those thoughts were already muddled. Not so much advanced recording, more advanced development of the song towards it's finished form.

 

Speaking only from my own perspective, structure, chords, melody, lyrics and even the title remain fluid until I'm content with a version, and that version gets released. Are all the constituent variations of a song (possibly hundreds) copyrighted if written or recorded? If so, that seems illogical ... although logic never features highly in litigation

 

Greg

[john]

I moved our convo to it’s own thread. Although related, it’s quite a long way from the NMF topic. I’ll link to it from New Music Friday 22 though.

 

No worries Greg, I got what you meant.  If my answer didn’t cover your question, I didn’t explain myself well enough.

 

It’s not that all possible versions are covered. It’s if a song is identified to have incorporated or have been derived from a song, that is covered. It stops being covered when it gets beyond recognisable.

 

Kind of mid thought but I’ll post more a little later… gotta go! I’m late! 

[Tonedead]

I find that making music nobody wants to copy helps immensely

[john]

6 hours ago, Tonedead said:

I find that making music nobody wants to copy helps immensely

There is that!

[MikeRobinson]

When you post your song, you should nevertheless assert your copyright and include the "©" symbol and the proper accompanying text.

 

If you intend to try to peddle your song commercially, or to publish it on a site where "take downs" are more likely, you should pony up your $35.00 at copyright.gov and register the copyright to your song (or "collection").  Your registration takes legal effect immediately, and it acts just like the "certificate of title" for your car.  It is an independently-verifiable record of your claim, made under penalty of perjury, that you do own the song and therefore have the legal right to market it.  Copyright registration also unlocks most of the penalties that you can use against any infringer.

 

(This comment reflects the copyright laws of the United States.  Most countries are party to international copyright treaties, but the laws and procedures vary from country to country. Copyright registration may or may not be available in yours.)

Edited June 20, 2022 by MikeRobinson

[GregB]

13 hours ago, MikeRobinson said:

you should pony up your $35.00 at copyright.gov

 

... or else just record all your songs (simple is fine) and release the 'album' via CD-Baby without any marketing.  At least a recording includes the title, lyrics AND melody.   
I think their limit is 50 tracks per 'album'. The one-off charge used to be $49 with occasional 'sale' prices. 

[john]

5 hours ago, GregB said:

 

... or else just record all your songs (simple is fine) and release the 'album' via CD-Baby without any marketing.  At least a recording includes the title, lyrics AND melody.   
I think their limit is 50 tracks per 'album'. The one-off charge used to be $49 with occasional 'sale' prices. 

Which, as far as I know, does not include registration of your work in America… if you don’t do this, protection of your works, and more particularly compensation, in the USA is much more limited.

[GregB]

John and I have circled this subject before and mine is the simple (naive?) perspective of a non-professional  musician. 

 

Of course you CAN sue, but who has the mental fortitude to do so ... let alone the MONEY to kick off the process? As for the RISK vs BENEFIT, if you sue and FAIL, the legal costs to pay both sides will completely break you. 

 

My suggestion is that the easiest/simplest/cheapest way of validating your creation is to record it in a form where the melody and lyrics can be proven and dated to be yours.  I'm sure any of the usual "no win, no fee" legal vultures will fight tooth and claw on your behalf if the $$$ are big enough (i.e. if the song is a million seller) ... and half of something is better than being totally screwed. 

 

 

https://www.legalzoom.com/articles/how-to-copyright-a-song ....

How to Copyright a Song

The key to knowing how to copyright a song is to know what copyright protects.

by Joe Runge, Esq.
updated May 02, 2022 ·  2min read

 

Registering a copyright gives your song the full benefit of copyright protection. Your song's music and lyrics are protected by copyright as soon as you record them, even if it's just a rough recording on your cell phone.

But to get the full benefit of copyright protection, including the right to sue people for infringing your copyright, you must register it with the U.S. Copyright Office.

Find out how to get full copyright protection for your song.

 

How to Get a Song Copyrighted

There are various state laws and international treaties that discuss copyright. For a song written, recorded, or performed in the United States, federal law grants to song creators these exclusive rights:

• To reproduce the copyrighted work in copies. This excludes others from making copies of your recordings or sheet music.
• To prepare derivative works. Excludes others from taking elements of your song to make new ones.
• To distribute copies. Excludes others from selling copies of your song out of the trunk of a car or on the internet.
• To perform the copyrighted work publicly. Excludes others from performing your song.
• To perform the copyrighted work publicly by means of digital audio transmission. Excludes others from playing a recording of your song.

If you want to know how to copyright music, simply knowing what exclusive rights are available is not enough. You also need to know how to get those rights—and how others can use them in their own songs.

How to Use Copyright to Protect Your Work

When it comes to lyrics, writing them in your notebook grants you instant legal music rights. Once the ink hits the page, you can assert any of the exclusive rights above the lyrics you've written. But what if someone in another city, several months later, writes very similar or even the same lyrics? How can you prove that you wrote them first?

Related: How to Pay Yourself in an LLC

Copyright registration is the process whereby you can establish your priority as the first author. For a small copyright registration fee, you put everyone on notice that these are your lyrics. Anyone who writes those same lyrics after the fact is subject to your exclusive rights as a copyright holder—and you don't even have to prove the later author ever saw your work.

The Library of Congress keeps a comprehensive list of every painting, poem, and song registration copyright. Although few songwriters scour song copyright registration to determine if a new tune infringes on an existing one—they probably should. Song copyright registration grants constructive notice to the song. The tune, the lyrics, the drum track on the recording, and chord progression in the bridge are each element an individual and expressive part to which the author can assert any of the exclusive rights.

That's why it's so difficult to create an automated song copyright checker. It would take a complex algorithm that could listen to music and integrate all the choices made by the composer, lyricist, and performer.

But you can know what is and is not protected—in your work and in the works of others. Before you pick up your guitar to strum a new tune, take a moment to recognize what parts of that song are your property and how to find out if any of it is someone else's.

[john]

19 minutes ago, GregB said:

But to get the full benefit of copyright protection, including the right to sue people for infringing your copyright, you must register it with the U.S. Copyright Office.

True, copyright exists from the moment the work is created. You will have to register, however, if you wish to bring a lawsuit for infringement in the USA. If you don’t register, suing isn’t an option. You cannot defend your copyright. 
 

Some choose to register their works because they want the facts of their copyright to be a matter of public record, complete with a certificate of registration.
 

Importantly, registered works may be eligible for statutory damages and attorney's fees in successful litigation. Also, your PRO and/or Musician’s Union often provide access to legal advice and coverage/help towards legal fees. If at some later point you are signed, you may also find your publisher will actively defend your copyright… but that only happens if your work is registered. Other parties may also consider backing legal defence of copyright, including no win no fee lawyers.
 

Registration must occur within five years of publication for it to be considered prima facie evidence in a law court.

 

As for sending a copy of your own work to yourself, sometimes called “poor man’s copyright.”, there is no provision in copyright law for this. It is not a substitute for registration.

 

I am not a lawyer, but I do like options. I am not keen on losing those options unnecessarily.

[GregB]

4 hours ago, john said:

I am not a lawyer

 

And even if you were, like every other lawyer you'd probably give me a different opinion ... and charge me the living cr*ap for it       Wouldn't it be great if songwriters were paid by the word and/or for the hours spent creating/producing.

 

And we've skirted the whole issue of BEING sued for having words/lyrics similar to someone else.  The more expensive the lawyers, the more likely the win. I still can't get over the case against Men At Work's song "Down Under" ... the flute riff was deemed to have ripped off "Kookaburra SIts In The Old Gum Tree" (a 1934 children's song).  I've tried hard but I still can't hear any direct resemblance.  Greg Ham, a brilliant musician, contributed the riff but wasn't named as a songwriter.  While Ham was never sued himself, he apparently felt guilty for being the one to have added the short riff ... especially when the band lost the case. He died at the age of 58, many believe due to the effects of the bitter copyright lawsuit.

 

Having just 12 notes available for any melody MUST lead to random convergence ... especially as we're unlikely to have heard 99.9% of the millions of songs 'out there'.  Of course, no-one is going to come after me UNLESS I strike it big, and there's little to no chance of that.

 

And yet, on the odd occasion I listen to a playlist of new music ... they ALL sound the same!!

 

[john]

1 hour ago, GregB said:

Having just 12 notes available for any melody MUST lead to random convergence ... especially as we're unlikely to have heard 99.9% of the millions of songs 'out there'. 

Genre convergence is a big issue. The more you conform to genre rules in melody, rhythm, instrumentation and language, the more likely there is to be collisions.

 

There are, of course, rules for resolving matches. That includes guidelines that try to take account of accidental influence. Still there is enough room to drive a fleet of buses through copyright rulings. Subjective doesn’t quite describe it.

 

Still, as @MikeRobinson points out, the fact that you can protect collections of works under a single filing cost, it’s a small price to pay to ensure you have your options open.

 

Also worthy of a mention, is the protection it gives you for someone getting you to take down your own song. ie another artist copies your song and then sues you after they do a catalog search in the library of Congress and realise that you never filed your songs! That would have to chaff lol