Collaborating, How Do You 'do It'?

[Danidog]

Hope I'm posting this in the right place.

 

I've been wondering, let's say you are a lyricist looking for someone to put a melody to your words. And, lets say you have an 'idea' of how you want your lyrics/song to sound. How do you express or convey your vision for your lyrics? Or, do you just turn it over to them and say, "have at it"?

 

Most of the time when I'm writing lyrics, I'm fuddling around with the guitar and from somewhere the lyrics and melody start coming in. Usually, it's just an idea, one sentence I turn into a verse and then it grows from that point forward. 

 

So, for those of you who 'do it' with or for others, how does THAT process work?

 

 

Thanks,

 

Dan

[Rudi]

I suppose you could record what you have.

 

You could annotate the lyrics.

 

If you have confidence in your lyrics, they should be able to say what you want. That is an ideal though. Many people have no clue what mine are about.

[Bernd]

I "collaborate" in two different ways:

the first approach is what you'd call "let 'em have it" - I simply share my lyrics with anybody who might be interested in setting them to music;

the second approach is writing to match other people's music.

 

Only after I had done quite a bit of the #2 approach did I have more success with the #1 approach, too (quite too many lyricists about, you see). Mind you, most of them are hobbyists that just do it for the fun of it and don't perform. I let them post on the internet, so at least I get a little promotion as a lyricist - if they're any good, that is ;-)

 

I actually enjoy if quite different pieces of music are based on the very same lyrics. When I have the time and feel like it I create my own songs as well. I seem to have a musical taste that none of my partners share, so there would be no use trying to convince them to do it my way ;-)

[starise]

Hum it over the telephone....I'm serious.

[Gazebo]

All of the collaborations I have been involved in have been a two way street.

 

I may have seen lyrics that inspire me, and have written some music and shared it back.  Sometimes my songwriting partner(s) think what I have done is good, add ideas or point the song in a completely different direction.

 

I tend to do several recorded "drafts" that I share, and we critique and change constantly, and I will also suggest lyric amendments or additions that I think would work.

 

Sometimes I develop a melody suggested by my co-writer, but I have always had a situation where all parties involved have a continuing interest in the song from inception, with agreed changes along the way.

 

Those changes can be difficult sometimes, where one or other particularly don't like something, but you have to be honest and allow the power of veto and rely on your co-writers to be both happy to compromise and to deal with contentious changes sensitively.

 

Honesty is the best policy, but be prepared to accept that it is a partnership and it's not all your way.  The end result is always better than you could achieve on your own. 

[tomcollins]

Cool subject,done a few in my time,with other musicians its a balance or a meeting of the minds, the process most times is a very cool thing most times, I'm very limited on the whole mixing and equipment thing,so that part is great when colabing with others

If it's lyricist only the i just strum out What comes to mind,have a wee bit of trouble if they dictate the sound ,theyare looking for , either way its a pretty cool process,i do like putting a melody to a lyric,my talent is very limited but its a fun process

Rock on

[Zson]

Good questions and answers.

 

I sometimes think about Lennon and McCartney,   It was a real give an take yet one person still had a core idea and the other one would help out with the tweaking...yet since they were there in the room with each other, both could play, sing, etc.  that made for a powerful song team.

 

As I read lyric only,  I really wonder, how will that work once you add in music?  I know I change my lyrics based on the music and then tweak it as needed. How can folk in separate physical places bring the two , the lyric and music together and create a good song.

 

 Yet to do all that by text alone? I have a hard time seeing that work out without a lot of extra time and work involved.

 

I just did a collaboration with a female singer / song writer.  I was fun and cool, but still very hard. It was a first time collaboration and though it went well it had problems with the final tweaking and she is right here in a nearby town. BTW, we did get a recording done of the song, still needs a bit of work.

 

One of the problems is that is just takes a while to get used to working with a co-writer. There were changes I wanted to make and did, but I didn't run them by the co author first....this was just 'cause I am not used to having a partner in creating a song. Yet I just said sorry and let go of some of the changes that I thought improved it...and it still was a good song.

 

So collaborating, I think,  is a very tricky deal. Seems like it would take a long time to get that synergy going that a good writing team needs

Edited March 22, 2015 by Zson

[TapperMike]

My last collaboration projects did not go well.  I'd write and record the foundation (drums, bass, guitars, keys. melody / harmony) and try to offer some direction on the part of the others involved.  The took the stems that I valued the most out of the score and slopped on craptastic leads.  Then had the audacity to share it with the greater internet stating that it was all their material.  They violated the CC agreement.  As a result I'm reluctant to do collab projects with others.

[McnaughtonPark]

My last collaboration projects did not go well.  I'd write and record the foundation (drums, bass, guitars, keys. melody / harmony) and try to offer some direction on the part of the others involved.  The took the stems that I valued the most out of the score and slopped on craptastic leads.  Then had the audacity to share it with the greater internet stating that it was all their material.  They violated the CC agreement.  As a result I'm reluctant to do collab projects with others.

Geez, that sounds terrible.  I don't even understand what makes people think the way they do sometimes. 

 

My collaborations have been great.  Some folks on Songstuff and I have done quite a few.  Sometimes I was presented with music and melody to write lyrics for, and sometimes they even had some of the lyric completed.  Sometimes they took the lyric and completely came up with music and melody to fit.  But everytime, before changing anything, we communicated what the change might be and asked what the other thought of it.  Then when posting, always give the other person their credits. 

 

Open communication, here's what I can do- here's what you can do - do you think we can work together in 50/50 split? 

 

It's fun to do, especially for a lyrics only member, who really needs to collaborate in order to hear the words in song form.  But it's a mutual respect deal, each person gets a say, and deserves to be heard.  A good trusting relationship can be built.

 

Tom

 

Havfe you read this thread Dan? http://forums.songstuff.com/topic/10127-songwriting-collaboration-for-lyricists/

Edited March 23, 2015 by McnaughtonPark

[Helmut]

As I always write the lyrics on "my own melodies" I don't have your problem.

 

I can imagine that collaborations work, as well as that they are frustrating. I think if you had successful collaborations you will collaborate with these muscians again. It is similar to normal bands with the exception you don't meet personally. And as with normal bands you will not find the right musicians straight away. It takes times and changes to find the right people to collaborate with.

 

I prefer to meet personally in the rehearsal room, to make music together, that's why I selected "Not Interested" with collaborations. If I hadn't my band, and wouldn't find musicians too, I surely would search for collaborations. As I got the possibility to play with good musicians I don't.

[TapperMike]

Not all of us have the wherewithal for IRL encounters.  At one point I was working two jobs and I was lucky to get a Tuesday or Wednesday Day only (still had to work that night) off.  What resulted is I had to schedule guitar lessons in the afternoon in order to get some jam / collaboration time in.

These days that's not even possible.

 

I really like the collaboration thing happening online here at songstuff even though I haven't joined in.   

[Janeva]

Great subject.

 

I'm not a musician so I purely write lyrics which I've done  by different methods over the years.

 

I write lyrics to existing melodies in most cases.  This has been done online via emailing mp3s because I have mostly worked with musicians from other countries.

 

I do know a local musician, however, who has taken my lyrics and then written music which has resulted in several songs I have had the pleasure of hearing him perform at my local bar    

 

Mostly, though, I enjoy writing to existing melodies and I find it more of a challenge to write words without the music already there.  

 

Jan

[TapperMike]

When I first came here (and still occasionally do) I'd scavenge through the Poets Corner looking for good lyrics.  If they had a good "flow" and contained good story writing I'd be all over it trying my hand at writing music to lyrics.  That's about where it would end as I'd never record anything.  Nonetheless it was a great pastime.