Piracy

[john]

Hey

Wondered what you guys thought of this:

http://www.scottmccloud.com/comics/icst/ic...cst-6-full.html

Cheers

John

[Steve]

Micro payments? Sounds like a great idea!

[Nightwolf]

I started out by thinking, "you can justify any thing, pirating is bad and you know it", but I slowly caught on that this was not the message. I have always thought micropayments (direct-payment is a better term IMHO) was awesome. I once paid $5 to download an album, (I think it was Stabbing Westward, but I could be wrong) complete with cover art which I used and incorporated some pics from a show to make my own unique cover. I'd do that again in a heartbeat. Bring it on!! We're with ya

[Rudi]

Sounds quite equitable to me.

[Riotlung]

I always prefer to get the actual album itself. Would you rather buy or download Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band?

I guess some people would be comfortable with paying a small amount to get the songs, while others might prefer to pay a little more for the fully packaged album. After all, the album itself was sold as a work of art in itself. It is overpriced though...

[Bitstream]

Adding some special signals to the original track so that the mp3 encoded file damages the listeners ears would be my approach

[Riotlung]

... that's a little too extreme, no?

[Nightwolf]

Adding some special signals to the original track so that the mp3 encoded file damages the listeners ears would be my approach

I think most pop music these days has that already

[Riotlung]

The albums are expensive because of the tremendous technology used to render converting to mp3 harmful?

[Bitstream]

I think most pop music these days has that already

You old fart, Nightwolf. You sound like a grandma... " that music will damage your ears son"

[Nightwolf]

don't forget to eat your veggies Mikey!! [smiley=bounce.gif]

[Bitstream]

don't forget to eat your veggies Mikey!! [smiley=bounce.gif]

only if i can wash em down with a nice bottle of chianti. fth fth fth fth fth

[TimmyMayes]

I'm all about micro payments. There was a really long and good article on the pirate website oink written recently. Let me see if i can find it.

http://www.demonbaby.com/blog/2007/10/when...k-birth-of.html

Its an awsome read because it really captures my opinoins on the whole market. Business is all about generating value. Record execs used to provide a service, aka generate a value; Screening new artists for potential. They also provided business services to artists who were not themselves business savy. But with all of the changes in technology and the availability of information on topics in the business spectrum they really do not provide any value and as such really need to be surgically removed from the market.

Myspace and youtube has helped alot with that. Bands are able to get themselves directly to the fans with so much ease these days as a result of these outlets its amazing.

Cheers,

Timothy

[Prometheus]

To be honest, I think they still could provide value if they would clean up their act, but they've been hoisted on their own petard... They've went for the shoddy gimmick, the optimum cut price, the slick assed fast food approach, the fleecing and abusing of people they have at a tremendous disadvantage, the ethical bypass, for so long that now it's being done straight back to them by black marketeers undercutting them, nobody has any sympthathy...

In short, the mp3 pirates are only doing to the recording company execs what they have been doing to everyone else for years. Frankly, if the industry does undergo a complete collapse into nothingness, good riddance to bad rubbish!

Edited December 19, 2007 by Prometheus

[TimmyMayes]

Agreed if the current system collapsed music wouldn't die it would just force a padagrim shift in the distribution methodology.

Cheers,

Timothy

Edited December 20, 2007 by TimmyMayes

[Prometheus]

Agreed if the current system collapsed music wouldn't die it would just force a padagrim shift in the distribution methodology.

Cheers,

Timothy

I had an interesting conversation with an obsequious record company executive two weeks ago who was making overtures at me for a press pack of a project I'm currently working on. I told him that I would gladly give him a press pack provided he could assure me that there was a one hundred percent chance that I would receive feedback on it.

I told him that as a musicologist who has studied to degree level and as a time served sound engineer, a veteran of several thousand recording sessions, I cannot analyze a complex piece of music completely in thirty seconds, and in fact no one can. I asked him to appreciate that like him I am a professional and I am very busy, so I do not appreciate my time being squandered by time wasters who intend to switch my CD's on and straight back off in thirty seconds, and that as one professional to another I would only be interested in dealing with him if he gave me his word that this would not occur...

I am still eagerly awaiting his response with baited breath...

It did occur to me, that I do the odd repair job on computers to supplement my income, and that if someone came to me and offered to let me work on their PC if I could impress them enough in a thirty second demonstration of my abilities, I would drop kick them across the street...

I am also working at BAE Prestwick at the moment to supplement my income over the festive season, and it occurred to me that if one of the girls who worked in procurment there were to say to a potential client, you have thirty seconds to give me a reason not to put the phone down, the directors there would drop kick her out of the front door...

As musicians, engineers and songwriters, let us do the same with these overweening grey suited recording industry nincompoops who are behaving in a manner that is equally risible to the two examples given above!

Edited December 21, 2007 by Prometheus

[TimmyMayes]

Thats a good point because alot of sites try to get you to buy a song but only supply you with a 30 sec clip of the song. Which is a big reason I rarely buy music online. I usually won't buy a cd based off of one cd because it can misrepresent same as a carefully selected 30 second clip of a song.

Cheers,

Timothy

[roxhythe]

I agree with the comments on the "impress me in 30 seconds" approach one gets these days out of the record industry. I think, though, it is based on a deliberate effort *not* to find new talent. As that, it works.

In my opinion, the music industry these days is operating off a vertical-integration business model. Somebody figured out (they figure this out every 20 years or so) that there is more money to be made if songs written by writers they 'own" are recorded by artists they own on labels they own and played on radio stations they own. And it does work--that's the old AT&T business plan, which AT&T pursued for over a hundred years, very successfully.

A key facet of that business plan, though, is not letting anybody new in. That's hard to pull off in a business based on the marketing of talent, but they've been doing it. I, and a lot of people I know, maintain much of what's spewed out by the music business is c**p--but I hear a lot of the un-c**p that never makes it to the radio or records because I hang out with other writers and musicians. But how many people *don't*? It will take (my opinion) someone of the attention-getting stature of a Bob Dylan to force a change--to make the industry decide between co-opting that person (which opens the door to a lot of others) or dying. And I do not see anybody like that out there yet.

Of course, the industry is working very hard at committing unintentional suicide right now on its own. (Couldn't happen to a more worthy bunch of folks.) Record prices have been obscenely high, and stayed that way. Teenagers, bless 'em, figured out ways to get their hands on the stuff for free. Instead of embracing the new technology, the business has concentrated on eliminating those who use it (while continuing to keep prices high)--and in the process, encouraging the technology and its use to be more widespread. Envision dinosaurs trying to trample all them little mammals. It didn't work then, and it's likely to not work now. (It is fun to watch. It probably would have been fuin to watch back then, too.)

I do see the process opening doors. I'm just not sure what the doors look like. Madonna said recently the way to make money in music in the future was going to be to perform, and she may be right. (She probably bodes listening to. They don't call her the Material Girl for nothing.) If so, records, like T-shirts and buttons, will become ancillary merchandise (and cheap). The demise of the vertically-integrated music business may provide opportunities for more independents (radio stations will, after all, still need stuff to play). It could get interesting.

Joe

[thelevellers]

I would agree 100% with that site, but I like CD's... For me I hate downloaded music (even paid for) because it just doesn't feel special... So I was quite glad when I realised it wouldn't be possible for me to 'steal' any more music (I say 'steal' because for me I just used it as a way of previewing the albums without standing in a record store for 45min! If I didn't like it I deleted it, if I liked it I went out and bought the CD, or at least added it to the 'to buy' list...).

What I think is possibly the best option is for new artists to make use of services that provide large numbers of CDs (I've forgotten all the names of the sites as I don't have links handy at the mo! lol) combined with services like soundclick that let you sell your MP3's online. Would that do away with all uses of record companies except for promo?! I suppose getting your record into actual shops would be hard, but meh, it's halfway there at least!!

Right, maybe it's time for a little browse of HMV or Amazon - My student loan came in yesterday!

Rohan

[AdamRave]

very interesting..

i agree.

the future is playing live.

tons of shows, bars, clubs, stadiums.

dont be picky, just play shows.

cell CD's.. tshirts, buttons.. whatever

but keep prices low.

my ep is available for download on my website (in mp3 format).

i dont care if you dont buy the cd.

BUT..

if you want to buy the cd, you can.

just come to shows, pay to get in, pay for murch.. everyone is happy.

you dig?