Is Originality A Myth

[Sakushika]

There was this song I produced that I was infinitely proud of creating because it was so beautiful. Until I heard it in the media.Turns out it already existed.

I had probably heard it a long time ago and forgot about it until it came back to the surface as I searched my brain for a new melody when composing "my song". And I mistook it for an original idea.

I have been extra careful ever since and have, many times, found myself putting melodies into the songs I produced that came from existing works, to the point where I have become so frustrated with my lack creativity that I'm losing the hope of ever even trying to make it as a producer.

But listening to the radio, I've noticed that many pop songs actually resemble each other.

So am I particularly uncreative or is copying previously made works (and adding their own spin to it) just what humans do? This would mean that all songs we create are no more than patchworks made up of pieces from the thousands of songs we have heard before.

I mean, ideas must come from somewhere after all, everything has a cause, so should I feel bad if I release a song that contains pieces of existing works and call it my own?

I'm not looking for an excuse to be a copycat and credit myself for the work of others. I genuinely put time and effort into creating something original, but it just keeps turning out that it has all been done before. I just don't want to waste time looking for something (total originality) that doesn't really exist...

Have you already created something that was 100% yours, completely original?

Or are you in the same predicament as me? How do you get out of it?

Thanks for reading.

[john]

Hi

Good topic.

Originality exists, otherwise all songs would be the same song

There is a lot of repetition or restatement of ideas though, intentional or not we are shaped by our personal influences and by what we hear whenever we are exposed to music. Afterall, genres are collections of similar characteristics, so if you write for any specific genre, be that electronic or country, you immediately have to conform to some extent. If you depart too much from the constraints of a genre, then you risk no longer being a part of that genre. If you think about it, most new genres come from a few things:

New melodic or harmonic evolution

New technology and production techniques.

Sometimes we use old things in new ways, sometimes new things in old ways. Often it is the combination of two or more things things (be they instruments or musical genres or one of each) and far more rarely it is when some genuine, virgin ground is developed.

Expanding your exposure to music can be a double edged sword. You gain the experience of combinations new to you, but in many ways you can perhaps also increase the chances that you are indirectly influenced by "soft" exposure, ie songs you hear in the background unaware of the exposure.

Most "new" music is a recombination of genre formulas. Sad, but commerciality and popularism has pushed music in that direction. In fact most software designed to make music creation more accessible also has the side effect of directly using pre-existing music chunks. For example, loops. The truly creative writer creates his own loops, with his own sounds. But it is a slow creation process. Much faster and more convenient is to create a song based on library loops and library samples and sounds. The same exists in country or blies or Jazz, where there are stock phrases, turnarounds, sound effects, whatever.

For me, creativity lies in the attention to detail, and the drive to create something original, including creating unique synth patches, or unusual harmonies or melodies, unexpected combinations etc. But it takes time and patience.

And an acceptance that sometimes, mistakes happen.

We can but strive to create something new and unique.

As a musician and writer, I can only hope that the casual acceptance by many musicians of stock/library sounds/effects/loops/samples/effects passes. Listeners seem to care less, in general, or so it seems. There doesn't appear to be any real drive by listeners to push for better, more inventive music. But that I think is a flawed perception.

Music in general is less prestigious than it once was. The public regards musicians as "less" than they once did. They buy less music. They have a music equivalent of shell shock. Overwhelmed, and too disenchanted to complain much. This is not aided by a huge back catalogue of fantastic music all available for them to listen to.

But where is the drive songwriters, composers, musicians, arrangers, producers and lyricists once had to push boundaries, to challenge the public? At what point did we change from a roar of originality to a squeak of meek acceptance?

No wonder fans are deserting music as being worthy of their attention. No wonder music have lost the respect for the entire music industry.

We've lost respect for ourselves, why on earth should others be interested?

Cheers

John

[TapperMike]

Great topic

 

There's nothing you can do that can't be done, No song you can sing that can't be sung.  (All you need is Love, The Beatles)

 

 

We covered a bit of this very thing here - http://forums.songstuff.com/topic/10862-is-it-better-to-be-self-taught-or-to-get-lessons/?p=199733

 

 

Just last night I was watching a Documentary on Nile Rodgers. (Chic, Sister Sledge, Duran Duran, David Bowie, Madonna, Diana Ross and many more)  He was the hitmaker.  He'd write, arrange, and produce other artists while backing them up on rhythm guitar.  He was a conscious writer. He would take elements of real life whether his or someone else's or even someone else's material and filter it.  When he wrote "Good Times" for Chic. He wrote it based on the song "Happy Days Are Here Again"

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhkk1tZzNjk

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AB2Y-ZsEak

 

 

So we are guided by our unconscious or conscious.  Often when we are guided by our unconscious what we are doing is trying to remember a song we may have heard before.  If you've heard a song three times ever... It's stored somewhere in your brain but may be buried by other information that comes later.  Songs never come fully formed in the brain.  They evolve in time.  When you become conscious that you may be touching on some pre existing material you can either throw the baby out with the bath water or you can evolve the song into something new. Songwriters, Novelists, Playwriters and Screenwriters do the same thing.

[Guest]

Every once-in-a-while, one of these questions pops up ---almost answering itself by being an unoriginal question--- and I get to uses one of my favorite responses;

 

Does it matter?

 

If originality doesn't exist, then it doesn't exist anywhere, not only in the realm of songwriting. And since there are thousands of people making their livings writing songs, originality cannot be a prerequisite.

 

At least once every day I hear ---or create--- a piece of music that seems new to me. I think that's just amazing.

 

Write songs! Have fun! 

[Rudi]

My last song was a problem. I realised late that it sounded like something else. Then I kept hearing other songs like it all over the place.

 

Let me give you the (short) list

 

You Got It - Roy Orbison

We Are Beautiful - Fern Kinny

Shes Electric - Oasis

 

Do all these songs sound the same?  No. Not really.

They have different melodies, phrasings, rhythms  and styles.

 

But they (and other lesser known songs) were all WEDGED IN MY HEAD !

I dont even like 'She's Electric', so why was I obsessing about it and the others?

 

Answer: They all have the same chord pattern in them. I was picking up on this subliminally, because they shared this with my song.

 

Just as well a chord pattern is not copyright, or else Fern Kinny would be suing Roy Orbison who would be suing the Gallaghers etc etc.

 

The point is, it helps to understand the elements of a song that resembles others, because you can change it OR, other elements that will remove it further from those annoying well known ones.

 

When you are new to creating music, its much harder, because the 'other' song takes over your thinking and you cant play your own song at all anymore.

 

Regard other similar songs as obstacles to be wary of, and ultimately overcome.

[rainsrocks]

I read the previous two comments and I agree to an extent with both of them but since this is a topic i think about a lot I wanted to add a couple of things that bounce around my head.  Please indulge

 

Previous to recorded music, music was created only by musicians.  There was a standard repertoire (it varies depending on your culture) that was passed along to every new generation of musicians.  Music was only made by musicians (not cd players) which made the musicians that were talented valuable to society.  If you wanted to hear music you had to go where it was being made in real time (church, juke joint, concert hall etc...).  This was also true of graphic art.

 

in our time you can buy a recording of louis armstrong playing "On the sunny side of the street" or Led Zepplin playing "stairway to heaven".  You can also decorate your walls with fairly good prints of Picasso, Van Gough, or whoever tickles your fancy.  The result of the changes modern technology has brought to our lives is that people are mostly interested in "original" art and music now.  Why pay the guy down the way to play you a blues song at your birthday party if you can just pop Howlin' Wolf in the CD player and listen to that?  True there were changes and evolutions to music and art in the past but they were more collective and slow and mostly came about as a result of genuine changes to peoples lifestyles and new cultural influences rather than because some genius came along and switched everything up.

 

That all said, I think that "originality" is and has always been about reinterpretation.  Some of the most creative artist of today build songs by sampling older recordings (hip hop and electronica).  The early blues and rock n roll artists were reinterpreting riffs and sentiments of older music.  The boon of great music that came in the 20th century was more about technological advances (recording, multitrack recording, electric instruments etc..) than actual exceptional talent.  I wouldn't worry too much about originality.  I try to make entertaining and imaginative music based on my cultural frame and don't care a lick about being "original".  I've also never had more than marginal success If people groove to it then it works.  There are only 12 notes in the western scale.

 

Danny

Edited September 29, 2013 by rainsrocks

[Desertrose]

This thread reminded me of this....if you haven't seen it, watch it. I thought it was brilliant.

 

 

I guess maybe it's the melody that counts?  

[john]

Absolutely, that is precisely why chord progressions are not normally part of a copyright claim, because copyright is all about what is original and chord sequences are generally far from original.

[Just1L]

I find Arcade Fire to be highly original. Their current popular song does remind me a little of disco in a way but I still think overall it's pretty original. They may not be a lot of people's cup of tea though. Although that doesn't matter at all.

 

[Desertrose]

I really enjoyed the above video. Different and interesting and what......no grinding provocatively swinging naked from wrecking balls or any lewdness at all?  Miracles do happen. 

[Simon Darveau]

Melodies make all the difference in the world ... if you are a guitar player, try this ...

 

Play the 'Every breath you take' (The Police) guitar part and start singing ... 'Stand by me' (Ben E. King) also performed by John Lennon in the seventies ...

[macmanmatty]

I believe there is no originality there was really only ever one song written and everyone just stole that one as best they could. Joking!!!

 

There is lots originality still, and  this should prove it 

[GordonG]

I often try to get away from music for a couple of weeks before working on new ideas, this helps to keep my head clear from other influences but as soon as people hear it I get " that sounds like ......" Often artist I haven't heard in years or even artist that I have never heard.

Heavy metal rips of blues and classical music some rip of folk and others rip off oldies and long forgotten songs but all this just comes down to one thing. inspiration, At the end of the day music is just the molding of sounds and as such doesn't really belong to anyone. (lyrics not included)

The only way you can get a sound that no one has done before is to created your own instrument and even then you will be using the same modes and scales that have been used since music began so on that note I wouldn't let it worry you, keep creating music and that totally original song may fall into your lap if not just have fun with it because music creativity wont come to you if you try to force it

[Alistair]

Heckler to Neil Young: "It all sounds the same!"

Neil Young to heckler: "Well, it's all the same song!"