Template for lyrics

[John W Selleck]

Hi all,

I have been asked about this a few times now so I will share it. My studio guy in America was Jim Heffernan. He was Joe Diffie's lead musician for his band and all his studio work for 7+ years and 3 gold plus LP's and Tracy Byrd's for another 4 years and more gold plus. He plays anything with a string you don't have to put a bow to and was learning the fiddle last time I saw him. He has pros coming to him for lessons on lead guitar, mandolin, dobro, and banjo. He has also put out at least 2 dobro LP's with some top pickers. He had his own studio in Nashille and was a song picker for Sony. He wanted to help me get ahead so he studied 5 years of top 5 songs and told me this. I have not always followed it, but I try.

 

1) Solid hook

2) If an old hook it must be given a new/interesting treatment

3) 2 1/2 to 3 1/2 minutes long. It can be longer if it will hold the listeners attention but this is the prime length for radio airplay.

4) Treat the verses as building blocks for the chorus. In fishing terms, they are the bait for your hook!

5) Set the hook hard! Make sure it is memorable and try to hit it more than once in your chorus!

6) Back to timing, usually 8 line verses and chorus, 2 verses and 3 chorus. You can adapt if you need for timing or to repeat the hook.

7) Bridges, only if you have time, or need to finish the story of the song.

8 ) Rewrite, rewrite, rewrite, until you are happy with every line.

9) If you can't make the verses and chorus feel different with lyrics, make sure they do with the music.

 

This is my template. Yes, I break it now and again, as I do every rule, and I do know them. An no, I am not an expert. I am just stumbling along the best I can.

 

[Cody]

The 2 1/2 to 3 1/2 minute thing is a newer phenomenon....prior to the probably 80's as radio was dying, under 2 was a pretty strict norm for the bigger radio "hits"  I'm sure there's plenty of charts and graphs and whatnot, just been my observations.  

 

Buddy Holly is a prime example.......don't know how many if any tunes he had clocking in over 2mins....all hook lyrically or riff wise no filler

 

Elvis is another example........well good elvis, heartbreak hotel, that ain't right, let me be your teddy bear, all shook up.......all under 2min

 

tons and tons of others, everly brothers, fats domino, ricky nelson.....I think they knew a thing or two about making hits  .........songs felt longer right? that's because it stuck and had you singing it and thinking about it later........when a song is all filler, well how many do you skip once you've heard your favorite bit? 

 

 

edit: oh I see in your post that was 5 years of study.......I tend to stop reading when people list accolades/awards hahah....  

 

some more great life advice I'd been given.........You can learn a lot from a person until they start listing all their achievements and awards, then they're out of stuff to teach  

[John W Selleck]

5 hours ago, Cody said:

 

edit: oh I see in your post that was 5 years of study.......I tend to stop reading when people list accolades/awards hahah....  

 

some more great life advice I'd been given.........You can learn a lot from a person until they start listing all their achievements and awards, then they're out of stuff to teach  

Yes, for many years, under 2 min was the norm. then came the late 60's till today. He figured 5 years of study of the latest hits would give a good idea of what was making it in the market. I listed some of his achievements so anyone could see why I listened to his advice. My musical achievements would be a much shorter list. Some people were asking about the template so I offered it up.

[John W Selleck]

3 hours ago, Patchez said:

I have to say, to be a jock took talent... segue's on the same Note even... but, that was a long time ago, and no one cares  

I do digress, don't-i  

Oh, anyway, -- no radio for me for over a decade, not sure if even works; well, except in my '65 Ford, AM, talk radio if can hear it anyway. I gotta sell that thing, -- I don't even need an AM Radio anymore... so why have the truck?

Yes, back in the day you had to work a lot harder to be a DJ. Today you talk and click on the mouse. I'm not even sure my template works great except for radio because there is so much free streaming out there and they don't have to worry so much about getting the ads in, but it is still something I try to use to keep me focused.

[Cody]

5 minutes ago, John W Selleck said:

Yes, for many years, under 2 min was the norm. then came the late 60's till today. He figured 5 years of study of the latest hits would give a good idea of what was making it in the market. I listed some of his achievements so anyone could see why I listened to his advice. My musical achievements would be a much shorter list. Some people were asking about the template so I offered it up.

 

yeah is all solid advice! I just think there's more of a trend going back to a shorter song..... with attention span deprived and click happy people especially.....I get it listing stuff....but me personally, I try to read between lines and think for myself whether someone is full of it or not really don't care who you know or what you've done.     I did go look at some graphs and such, seemed about mid 70s was when more than 2m10s became the average hit of top 40...went about to 4mins in the 80s and down to about 3.5 in the 90s where it still mostly is.  

 

#9) is particularly useful especially if you're like me and just tend to write verses......change music on your favorite and sing it twice....wahlah a chorus  

[John W Selleck]

3 hours ago, Cody said:

 

yeah is all solid advice! I just think there's more of a trend going back to a shorter song..... with attention span deprived and click happy people especially.....I get it listing stuff....but me personally, I try to read between lines and think for myself whether someone is full of it or not really don't care who you know or what you've done.     I did go look at some graphs and such, seemed about mid 70s was when more than 2m10s became the average hit of top 40...went about to 4mins in the 80s and down to about 3.5 in the 90s where it still mostly is.  

 

#9) is particularly useful especially if you're like me and just tend to write verses......change music on your favorite and sing it twice....wahlah a chorus  

Thanks, I see lots of different ways people write songs. Some with lots of words, some with very few, some with totally different V/C, some with the same, etc. I've found it hard to get a real story/feeling out in under 2 1/2 anyway, and I tend to go longer. i've had a couple in the 6 min. range. Today with streaming for many indie artists, it's OK to go longer, but still, if you want to sell to the big names, or even someone with a decent manager trying to be a big name, 4 min. is about it.

And yes, #9 is fine with the way I write too. lots of my chorus go up, and we work hard to give them at least a different melody line and phrasing.

[John W Selleck]

3 hours ago, Patchez said:

Actually, you had another commenter who mentioned in your OP.
  -- And from that I inferred, a track bed, so to speak into which the song was produced. It's potentially "easier" to provide a genre or style "template" to then, -- do your thing. Like a Document Template, you then do the Branding upon, so to speak. However, I could have inferred incorrectly, -- I am often incorrect, but never wrong  

Actually, it's just for lyrics, and it's adaptable for each song, genre, BPM, and time signature. Nothing is written in stone, but it's the way I write most of my lyrics. The document template is in my head. LOL! I am doing a low more lyrical pauses, some of them pregnant, and stretching words out a lot more than I used to.

Yes , again, lots of people making lots of money from videos. When I finally get to the Philippines again I will hook up with someone whi is very good with that and put a lot of my songs on youtube and try to cash in there to.

[John W Selleck]

3 hours ago, Patchez said:

But, the doctor gave me meds for that so, it's all OK now   kidding, kidding ... ... 

Mine gave me some too but I looked at his life, then mine, and decided not to take them.

I throw out the rules all the time. But knowing them is nice too.

[Just1L]

Cool John. Thanks for posting this. I spend a lot of time trying to remain outside of the box but think maybe it's time to look at being in one every now and again.

[John W Selleck]

7 hours ago, Just1L said:

Cool John. Thanks for posting this. I spend a lot of time trying to remain outside of the box but think maybe it's time to look at being in one every now and again.

Hi Randy, I've written a lot outside the box but that wasn't what they were looking for. Now I write mostly inside buty still break the rules when I need to. The key is still having an "In", or doing what you do and working to get more plays online or indie/outlaw radio/streaming radio.

 

[James Anderson]

i would   rather  have  the  music listener  wish  i had  written  one  more  verse   than  one  too  many😎

[John W Selleck]

5 minutes ago, James Anderson said:

i would   rather  have  the  music listener  wish  i had  written  one  more  verse   than  one  too  many😎

I agree, in order to get a lot of people to hear it/them wehave to get the song/songs played. Many of us can write 5+ minute songs and tell wonderful stories but it's like the question of the tree falling in the forest, if no one hears it does it make any sound.