Songwriting gotchas

[jd73]

Hi all. I've been experimenting with songwriting for a bit but there's always something missing. Whether it's a hooky melody or words that don't really seem to fit the subject, something always seems a bit ... crummy, like it could be significantly better. What things do people actively have to watch out for when writing lyrics, and how do you get around them? Thanks!

[john]

Hmmm. This could be a long post, but I don't really have time right now. Meanwhile I will try to mention a few things to look out for.

 

Some main issues:

• Forced rhymes
• The wrong rhyme scheme for the emotion
• Using the wrong language for the 'voice' of the song
• Inconsistent rhyme scheme
• Using unnatural phrasing/not being conversational
• Lacking an emotional dynamic
• Using words / melody / arrangement that do not compliment each other, that fight each other
• Being inconsistent with the message
• Lacking clarity or commitment to the message
• Not having a message
• Being inconsistent with the vehicle
• Not using or understanding hooks / placing hooks in the wrong or poor place
• Using hooks that fight each other
• Not using a range of hooks (lyrical, melodic, rhythmic etc)
• Not using a clear and complimentary structure
• Not using song real estate wisely
• Cramming the story into one verse and chorus leaving the rest of the song to filler and pointless repetition
• Not using repetition wisely
• Not understanding the use, and therefor power, of different sections of a song
• Giving away the song lot in the title
• Giving away the entire song plot in the first verse
• Overusing the same structure/theme/story/concept across too many songs
• Not using prosidy
• Lyricists not understanding lyrics are not a poem. Lyrics have some unique needs because they have to fulfil musical needs. The words do not exist alone in a song.

 

I'll come back to what you can do about them... gotta go!

 

Cheers

 

John

 

[jd73]

^ That's ^ bleeping fantastic, thanks!

[MikeRobinson]

"But also ... Peer Review!"

 

When you are the writer, you are perhaps-inevitably the most severe critic of your own work.  "But... are you maybe just too close to it?"

 

There's really only one way to find out:  "try it out, in front of a few of your songwriting friends."

 

Fortunately for you, this website(!) is a community of "just such 'friends.'"  Go ahead and post your "lyrics in progress," and also your "proposed melodies."  You will get quite-candid reviews ... which, I think, are most-valuable because they came from someone other than yourself.

 

Always(!) Remember:  "Every book that you buy at a bookstore is a final draft."  Likewise every song that you hear or download (from a professional source).  You have absolutely no idea how many committee meetings there were!  The first time you're allowed to see "their version of Michelangelo's David," the floor has been meticulously swept free of every single marble chip. 😀   "Why, yes.  Of course it was always meant to be this way.  Of course it's magic ..."

 

As I once heard it said:  "The creation of any work of art is like the birth of a child.  At the time, it's uncertain, it's messy, and frankly rather bloody.  But, thereafter, it seems like a foregone conclusion."

[GregB]

I reckon the first and only critic to please is YOU.   And you've got to be HARD on your material.

If something doesn't feel right, then it isn't right.  If after some time a word (or phrase, line, couplet, section) doesn't come good with small fixes ... then rip it out and try to fill that blank space from scratch.

 

On my first singer-songwriter album there were some words/phrases that were almost right and I accepted it (who was I to think I could do better).  The recording have haunted me ever since.  With the 2nd and 3rd albums, I had to feel they were 100% right (with the 'ear' I had at the time).  It's nice if other people like my songs but, in the end, I don't care what others think ... it's ME that will have to live with the results.  I have thrown away thousands of phrases and lines because they just didn't work well enough.  But that creativity remains with you and will resurface in another form and word combination.

[bard2dbone]

The thing that frustrates me most has always been when I tried to use a phrase or saying that I was sure everyone would know and large fractions of the audience would come up to me individually to ask what that was that I'd been talking about.

 

Examples -  In a recent political song that I was working on,  I was trying to point out that one side gets angry about what's being done specifically to hurt them by the people in the capital. So they get so worked up...that they protest by voting specifically for the people that are hurting them, rather than the ones who want to help. This reminded me of the farm rabbits in Watership Down. They had formed sort of a religious cult that looked forward to being the rabbit chosen to end up on the dinner table.  The phrase I used was "*worshiping the silver wire".   Apparently nobody reads Watership Down anymore. Nobody got it.

In one I set up several heavily stacked rhymes to make the listener expect a certain line...and then twisted it for effect. The previous three lines had ended in "going home", "all alone", and "on my own". Then the next line, complete with a pause, was "*People in glass houses shouldn't throw...parties." I thought everyone would get it. Few did.

When you shake dice before throwing them, the term for when they rattle around in your hand before the throw is a "gambler's dance".  I had a line that said "Life is just a game of chance, a flip of a coin, a *gambler's dance,"  I bet two dozen people asked me what a gamblers dance was.

Another song had a character who was doomed from the start. I said it as "She was on the *road that's paved with good intentions." Lots of people asked what that meant.

 

* If any of these confuse you, ask me. Just know that as I type, I will be rolling my eyes.

[John W Selleck]

5 hours ago, bard2dbone said:

The thing that frustrates me most has always been when I tried to use a phrase or saying that I was sure everyone would know and large fractions of the audience would come up to me individually to ask what that was that I'd been talking about.

Been there done, that, got the t-shirt. Even worse for me because many of the sayings I know are dead and gone. When I was young, all I listened to was country, then, growing up through the late '60s, in the flower child era, after coming back from Vietnam, I did the whole hippy thing. Acid rock and folk were the thing and I jumped in wholeheartedly. If there was a drug, I tried it, some a whole lot more than once, then eventually I had to grow up. The lyrics from that era, kids today wouldn't understand at all. I'm not sure I do anymore. Most popular songs today, in any genre, are songs people can understand the meaning of. See "How hard is simple" in the musicians lounge. Most people don't want to think to understand songs anymore. So I found my target audience and that is who I write for, mostly. Some lyrics I write for me and no one will ever see.

[GregB]

Nice phrases ... but why be upset? 
I read Watership Down decades ago but couldn't have placed the words ... but it does not matter ... good words are good words.  "Worshiping the silver wire" can be interpreted diferent ways (which is good thing). 

You can't second-guess other people, so write primarily for yourself ... which, even if you don't believe it, you are doing anyway.  If YOU are pleased with your lyrics, then you get 100% creative satisfaction.   The ones who 'get' what you mean are your real audience.  If you want to make money by writing pop for a narrow demographic, then you are beholden to write what THEY understand, but it'll probably make you miserable. 

[john]

On 1/28/2020 at 10:35 AM, GregB said:

I reckon the first and only critic to please is YOU.   And you've got to be HARD on your material.

If something doesn't feel right, then it isn't right.  If after some time a word (or phrase, line, couplet, section) doesn't come good with small fixes ... then rip it out and try to fill that blank space from scratch.

 

On my first singer-songwriter album there were some words/phrases that were almost right and I accepted it (who was I to think I could do better).  The recording have haunted me ever since.  With the 2nd and 3rd albums, I had to feel they were 100% right (with the 'ear' I had at the time).  It's nice if other people like my songs but, in the end, I don't care what others think ... it's ME that will have to live with the results.  I have thrown away thousands of phrases and lines because they just didn't work well enough.  But that creativity remains with you and will resurface in another form and word combination.

I wouldn’t say “only” because music is also about communication. It is one thing to make music for a pop audience (nothing wrong with that) and another just wanting to be understood. There are many reasons to make music. Some are driven by an inner vision, others by an inner or outer goal. Some want to be adore, others for artistic fulfilment. Truth is, few are driven by one thing alone.

 

Critique itself is about many things. Being interested in what critics say is not a weakness. If you are artistically driven by delivering messages, such as someone who writes anti-war songs, and you rely upon the passion of the song to move people, then knowing your crafted song comes across to a number of people as a wishy washy song about war that isn’t particularly anti-war... is a good thing to know. If you aren’t sure why then getting ideas from others is a good thing.

 

Sometimes the limitation we meet in expressing our art is to do with our skill level. In this critics (depending on who those critics are) can be useful in that their explanations can help you advance.

 

where I do agree with you is that you are the writer and editor. You shouldn’t change your song to keep the critic happy. Instead you listen to what they say and consider it. Then, IF you agree , you change it, if not you leave it.... or perhaps you see the problem but fancy a different solution. Points to consider may well be related to who you can reach, but it is your decision.

 

Lastly, if you earn your living from your music, you may not always have the luxury of making music purely for yourself.

[John W Selleck]

5 hours ago, john said:

Lastly, if you earn your living from your music, you may not always have the luxury of making music purely for yourself.

I know I'll never make a living at this but It wouldn't hurt to make a few extra bucks so I'll write the ones for profit, hopefully, and the ones for me.

[john]

1 hour ago, fasstrack said:

Do you do books? Sheila Davis has many that are very helpful. She covers the bases, and---what helped especially---gives many student examples before and after her critique.

 

The one I have: Successful Lyric Writing. It's from the mid-'80s, but not at all dated. There's probably an updated, post-Internet edition.

 

Good luck!

Does who do books?

 

Successful Lyric Writing is a great book. I don’t always agree with her, but I think it is one of the best books out there

[MikeRobinson]

On 1/28/2020 at 5:35 AM, GregB said:

On my first singer-songwriter album there were some words/phrases that were almost right and I accepted it (who was I to think I could do better).  The recording have haunted me ever since. 

 

But also remember this:  "you are the writer, not the audience."  When you listen-back to your own material, you can never actually listen to it as a brand-new listener does.

 

We wouldn't get very far in our infatuation if certain well-known artists had pored too much over their lyrics:

 

Quote

Dear God, why didn't I say it this way?  "There's a lady who's sure who knows all that glitters is gold ..."   OMG!  This song sucks!  😃

 

Sometimes, we are our own worst critic.  And sometimes, we are dead wrong.

 

There comes a definite time in the life of any commercial product when you must "shrink-wrap the thing and send it out into the world."  (FISI™ ==  "😯 it ... ship it!")

 

When that moment happens, promise yourself that you won't look back.