Will Music be destroyed by AI ?

[Jac]

 

l asked my AI chat the above question.

 

This is the reply l got.

 

'As AI becomes more advanced they will be able to compose music that is comparable in quality to that of human composers. This could potentially lead to a situation where AI composed music is preferred over music composed by humans, leading to a decrease in demand for human composers.'

 

Question: what do you think AI is doing to the music industry and will it ' destroy human composed music' ?

 

 

 

[MisterB]

People have lots of varied reasons for writing songs (and music) that aren't necessarily about fame and fortune. AI bots have to be trained on something. So how do they define new genres and write with the creativity and personal experience of someone who wants change?  

 

I can see it affecting some work for hire industries, like music for TV and film, where the music is secondary to a visual, but it won't replace songwriters. It may just make it more difficult for them to reach their audience, through market saturation.

 

AI in the industry has a lot going for it - we've seen this with advancements in plugins that make our lives as songwriters and audio engineers easier, without taking away the personality that we're putting into our writing.

[john]

On 7/25/2023 at 10:13 AM, Jac said:

Question: what do you think AI is doing to the music industry and will it ' destroy human composed music' ?

Music tech has often lead to new genres, new ways of working. AI is across all tech, not just music tech, so it is a much broader revolution.

 

Like all tech lead revolutions, people fall into 3 primary camps:

 

1. Those who are 100% for it
2. Those who are 100% against it
3. Those who will happily use the old way or the new way… they are results driven

 

Looking back at previous trends it looks like:

Initially group 2 hold sway

Then group 1 burst through and burn bright for a short time

Inevitably group 3 dominate

 

Group 3 are focused on what works. When it come to work, people will not be replaced by AI. People will be replaced by people using AI. I tend to think AI offers advantages to songwriters and composers, musicians, recording engineers and producers… and they ultimately get to choose if they use use them or not.

[Jac]

5 hours ago, john said:

Music tech has often lead to new genres, new ways of working. AI is across all tech, not just music tech, so it is a much broader revolution.

 

Like all tech lead revolutions, people fall into 3 primary camps:

 

1. Those who are 100% for it
2. Those who are 100% against it
3. Those who will happily use the old way or the new way… they are results driven

 

Looking back at previous trends it looks like:

Initially group 2 hold sway

Then group 1 burst through and burn bright for a short time

Inevitably group 3 dominate

 

Group 3 are focused on what works. When it come to work, people will not be replaced by AI. People will be replaced by people using AI. I tend to think AI offers advantages to songwriters and composers, musicians, recording engineers and producers… and they ultimately get to choose if they use use them or not.

That's really interesting John.

I'm not yet sure which group l fall under yet. l intially disliked the concept of AI generated in the music industry, but after listening to some of it's creations i'm very impressed, some l do indeed like very much.

 

l use AI a lot for my research studies. It's a tool that's very useful  for me and it's so fast l feel l wish it was available years ago.

But that brings me back to another question, ' Are humans getting lazy..too lazy'

To me (talking about myself for creative work ) l think l would say yes.

l actually wish it wasn't there for the music industry. l want to feel that the music i'm listening too has a human emotional side that l can connect to. 

l asked the AI chat' what do you mean'  after it's first reply,

here's what it said.

 

'It means that AI will not destroy music but rather change the way we create and consume it'

 

so going back to humans  fundamentally getting more and more lazy  ( possibly) in the Creative Arts, will we all eventually prefer AI generated music.

l hope not.

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Jac

[Jac]

18 hours ago, MisterB said:

People have lots of varied reasons for writing songs (and music) that aren't necessarily about fame and fortune. AI bots have to be trained on something. So how do they define new genres and write with the creativity and personal experience of someone who wants change?  

 

I can see it affecting some work for hire industries, like music for TV and film, where the music is secondary to a visual, but it won't replace songwriters. It may just make it more difficult for them to reach their audience, through market saturation.

 

AI in the industry has a lot going for it - we've seen this with advancements in plugins that make our lives as songwriters and audio engineers easier, without taking away the personality that we're putting into our writing.

That's really interesting thought's, thank you.

 

AI chat replied  to me that

'  if AI composed music is prefered over music composed by humans, it could lead to a flood of mediocre indistinguishable   unoriginal music.'

 

l think the danger is that it is already being prefered over human composers

Humans, as consumers ,are changing, and in my opinion,  not for our own good.

 

l asked AI chat, 'how much is AI used in the Music Industry today'?

It's reply was ' it didnt know as it didnt have the data' !!!

 

So who is going to collect and track the data if AI is'nt ?

 

 

 

[MisterB]

2 hours ago, Jac said:

l think the danger is that it is already being prefered over human composers

Humans, as consumers ,are changing, and in my opinion,  not for our own good.

Where is the evidence that AI music is preferred over human composers?

 

I agree with your last statement. 

[VoiceEx]

Hey @Jac! I haven't been very active lately due to work and life stuff getting the way, but I would like to briefly touch on this topic.

 

Speaking as a human composer, I can attest that I am not concerned about AI "replacing" me anytime soon, nor am I concerned about fellow composers who use AI to their advantage. In fact, at the risk of pissing people off, I don't understand why technophobes are still a 'thing' these days. I think its great that this sort of technology is finally becoming accessible for everyone.

 

I mean, sure, like all things in life, there will be some negatives. If your looking for a flood of generated garbage, that's something that you can find even right now. However, I don't think that's going to 'define' the future of music in the grand scheme of things. Its like asking: "Who do you think is going to sell more tickets? Skynet or Taylor Swift?" 👍

 

If I had to sum it up in just a few words, i'd say that the introduction of AI as an everyday tool is more akin to the introduction of cellphones, then it is to anything else. If a composer gets "replaced", its not because of the AI. But rather, because he might have conducted business as a tone def factory worker.

[Peggy]

Given the progression that we have lived to experience, I believe, in future periods of time, that AI will replace many industries and creative endeavors, especially with our acceptance and uses of the ever increasing power of technology's tools and communications to capture, supplement, create and manage. 

 

We are now and have for many many years, been developing and training AI with every stroke of the keys and with every device that recognizes speech and sound or tracks locations. Government's and industry's knowledge and uses of AI are way ahead of the people's awareness and even our ability to comprehend.   

 

Is it all for the good?  No.  Is it all for the bad? No.  It will be the generations ahead, if it is still possible at that point, to determine how far they let AI go. 

 

Will humans still be able to wholly create their art, write their lyrics, perform their songs? Absolutely.     

 

Will there still be a Music industry?  Probably, in some fashion ... as it has since the beginning, it will continue to morph and change.  

[john]

13 hours ago, Jac said:

That's really interesting John.

I'm not yet sure which group l fall under yet. l intially disliked the concept of AI generated in the music industry, but after listening to some of it's creations i'm very impressed, some l do indeed like very much.

 

l use AI a lot for my research studies. It's a tool that's very useful  for me and it's so fast l feel l wish it was available years ago.

But that brings me back to another question, ' Are humans getting lazy..too lazy'

To me (talking about myself for creative work ) l think l would say yes.

l actually wish it wasn't there for the music industry. l want to feel that the music i'm listening too has a human emotional side that l can connect to. 

l asked the AI chat' what do you mean'  after it's first reply,

here's what it said.

 

'It means that AI will not destroy music but rather change the way we create and consume it'

 

so going back to humans  fundamentally getting more and more lazy  ( possibly) in the Creative Arts, will we all eventually prefer AI generated music.

l hope not.

 

You can of course change group with time. While there are diehards in all groups, many will change the group they identify with.

[VoiceEx]

6 hours ago, buckoff said:

I know her future , she will married by 40 years old have one kid , cut her touring down 50% with one billion in the bank by then

 

 

To be fair, that's not a bad way to fade out 😅👍

[VoiceEx]

34 minutes ago, buckoff said:

Nope not at all , she had very supported parents , They moved  to Nashville at 15 13 or whatever it was , Just for her . She gets grief , Jealousy and all that , Oh no the internet does not love me today , she says. I'm guessing of course , she seems pretty hooked on fame 

 

Does the internet love anybody? 😅

 

Though to be perfectly honest I don't really follow up on celebrities unless something interesting goes on with them. However, I do think that being as famous as she is must be an awful experience. I mean, even "regular" musicians get shade for how they conduct themselves publicly (i.e in mass). I can't imagine what it must be like for her.

Edited July 28, 2023 by VoiceEx

[Jac]

21 hours ago, MisterB said:

Where is the evidence that AI music is preferred over human composers?

 

I agree with your last statement. 

That's my worry because according to my research there is not yet a complete data collection of how much it is used in the Music Industry. There are University  studies going on , York is one of them, but ( according to AI chat) to see if people like AI generated music, 

but im not confident it is fully being tracked as l asked it how much is it being used in the Music Industry and it replied

 

'it didnt know.' !!!

 

l feel that music consumers are now getting so use to AI generated music that they prefer it ( im becoming one of them ) Many big bands admit to using AI as part of their music compositions.

 

So l asked AI chat..' so will AI then replace and be indistinguishable from human composed pieces.

 

its answer was..... 'Yes'

 

 it continued...'' Ai is becoming more and more advanced and it wont be long before a computor can be used to make new versions of every music genre that are indistinguishable from human composed pieces.]

 

 So l guess my concern is that we cant stop progress in all technology but in my opinion its moving far too fast, and my concern is its not being tracked enough to see where it will lead. We are told there are studies going on to see if consumers prefer it ( AI chat told me AI generated music accounts for 90% of all music)

So if its 90% it must logical mean consumers are already preferring it or it would'nt be that high !

 

l remember a film called ' Demolition Man' 

l love that 'tongue in cheek' humor of the futuristic world and one section showed the characters listening to old time advert jingles, which they played over and over as they loved it to anything else on the music channels. lol

 

l dont like AI  technology and l dont like it being used in the music Industry but im a music consumer and l seem , at moment ,to be preferring it in my choice of music ( which l have no way of knowing if its on the tracks im listening to, but it must be a lot if its in 90% being used.) .

and that makes me very sad.

 

Edited July 28, 2023 by Jac

[Jac]

17 hours ago, VoiceEx said:

Hey @Jac! I haven't been very active lately due to work and life stuff getting the way, but I would like to briefly touch on this topic.

 

Speaking as a human composer, I can attest that I am not concerned about AI "replacing" me anytime soon, nor am I concerned about fellow composers who use AI to their advantage. In fact, at the risk of pissing people off, I don't understand why technophobes are still a 'thing' these days. I think its great that this sort of technology is finally becoming accessible for everyone.

 

I mean, sure, like all things in life, there will be some negatives. If your looking for a flood of generated garbage, that's something that you can find even right now. However, I don't think that's going to 'define' the future of music in the grand scheme of things. Its like asking: "Who do you think is going to sell more tickets? Skynet or Taylor Swift?" 👍

 

If I had to sum it up in just a few words, i'd say that the introduction of AI as an everyday tool is more akin to the introduction of cellphones, then it is to anything else. If a composer gets "replaced", its not because of the AI. But rather, because he might have conducted business as a tone def factory worker.

l agree, we should look at AI as a every day tool. But it dos'nt mean we have to like it.  AI is in fact changing me.

l feel lm rebelling against AI and that l cant control what its doing to me .

here's an example

All my life iv had a passion for Art. l was told at an early age l had potential and had a chance to go to Art college  even at a young age, but  circumstances was against me, and l couldnt go,.But to my delight l went to Art collage many years later as a mature student to do my Btec Art Course.

l was deeply disappointed. The young and mature Art students l found had no 'new' inspirations in their creativity.

l also went to many new Art galleries and followed new Artists. l found the same thing, a lack of new creativity.

Then came along AI in the Creative Arts. l was and still am mesmerized by it . 

But l dont 'like it' as l now seem to prefer the creativity that AI brings  in Art ,that should be inspired by human creativity. 

l find l cant help worry about the future of the creative arts.

l know im not alone in that thinking.

Is AI good for the creative arts,? who knows, but at the moment im being  enticed by it when l really dont want to, as l seem to not to  be able to stop it enticing me in the very Creative Arts l love.

 

[MisterB]

3 hours ago, Jac said:

 it continued...'' Ai is becoming more and more advanced and it wont be long before a computor can be used to make new versions of every music genre that are indistinguishable from human composed pieces.]

 

 So l guess my concern is that we cant stop progress in all technology but in my opinion its moving far too fast, and my concern is its not being tracked enough to see where it will lead. We are told there are studies going on to see if consumers prefer it ( AI chat told me AI generated music accounts for 90% of all music)

So if its 90% it must logical mean consumers are already preferring it or it would'nt be that high !

 

l remember a film called ' Demolition Man' 

l love that 'tongue in cheek' humor of the futuristic world and one section showed the characters listening to old time advert jingles, which they played over and over as they loved it to anything else on the music channels. lol

 

l dont like AI  technology and l dont like it being used in the music Industry but im a music consumer and l seem , at moment ,to be preferring it in my choice of music ( which l have no way of knowing if its on the tracks im listening to, but it must be a lot if its in 90% being used.) .

and that makes me very sad.

 

 

I'd say, don't believe everything your bot tells you. There's no way that AI generated music accounts for 90% of all music. Absolutely no way.  And there's part of the problem. All the bots know is what they find on the internet.  About as accurate as Wikipedia.  

[Jac]

58 minutes ago, MisterB said:

 

I'd say, don't believe everything your bot tells you. There's no way that AI generated music accounts for 90% of all music. Absolutely no way.  And there's part of the problem. All the bots know is what they find on the internet.  About as accurate as Wikipedia.  

yeah, l questioned that as well as it didnt seem correct.

 

So l looked up the source if the information. Apparently its on the renown trusted 'Complex 'website from a feature it ran on March 22 2023.

it asks the question,'How will AI impact the future of music' ?

one participant was Stephan Heinrich, CEO of mayit who says, quote : AI generated music will move access up to 90%

 

Complex says it spoke to Artists, AI experts and music industry professionals to find out how AI impacts music in the coming years.

 

its fascinating reading ,as many participants in the music world asks the very questions l ask.

 

 

[Jac]

18 hours ago, buckoff said:

So thats AL 

 

https://www.makeuseof.com/ways-to-use-ai-in-music-production/?_kx=TGIm6cGp2sojGLR8KG7hLCgYFhkkjtMlS6A99zdjMsEZEFHda6W3bgEQ34fwP5na.RQfqrU

 

I had no idea 

ok 

1/ Al Writes song from his data base on human emotion 

2/ Al does the tracks from his data base on human emotion  

3/ Al sings it from his data base on human emotion 

4/ Mix it same deal and we got a song 

Why would we need humans, But to push a few buttons ? 

Ok so Al has data on all the rules of songwriting 

Structures whats working in 2023 on trends . Al how many songs have bridges ? Were chorus'es 8 lines or 6 , did they use pre's , was 2nd vrse's less lines then ist verse ? What was at time at 2:50 ?

So you give him a hook , Say I wish Yesterday was today 

He scours lyrics on all hits . Ok Al lets begin , Al break a few rules so the song stands out 

Yes I compute .analyzing data now , please stand by . its not really far fetched on a robot doing that 

If you were a genuis , You could invent a robot and program doing all that . .analyzing all data on hits drum beats ect ect ect . Then a team say 4 people , taking that data and using it . To a extent , thats what hit writers do now , But much slower 

AI technology in music creation is very complex.  It takes years of training and is more than just ' pushing buttons'. l know what you mean  though when you say that, it can seem as simple as that. But Music AI is one of the fastest growing  new industries and many fear it will take over the music industry as it advances, which is rapid.

 

As far as i'm aware there is no status at the moment for a Music Artist to declare he uses AI to create his work.

Some Artist do admit to using AI in their work, Foo Fighters are one of them. Im not able to find out which bands are using AI to create their work, as there is no date being collected.

 

So when l see and listen to a song l like and l look to see who wrote the song, l have no idea if it was AI used.

To me that's very wrong,

Taylor Swift was asked about it in a round about way concerning her songwriting. She didnt answer fully , just said it was a 'damaging question'

Why was it a damaging question to be asked if she uses AI in her songwriting ?

 

As far as im aware ( please let me know if im wrong on this information)  there is no data collected at the moment  which large Artists are using AI to create their work or that they have to declare that their songs was written by AI and not them selves.

 

If AI is used , lets say in a  in a hit song, (which we know it must be as it's being used extensively )  there is no way of knowing how much of that song is AI generated, was it fully, partly or non ?

 

question; is that right or wrong for the consumer  not to know ?

 

l would think AI is being used more than we know in the music industry as there is great interest in the technology. As you say it does the work of a songwriter, but faster.

 

l was interested to read on the Complex website where a Artist of many years  expressed his concerns about AI in the industry even though he uses AI himself extensively in his work. But he then said he was now looking for AI software that will use songwriting and the AI  to make the full Artwork based on the emotions and moods it picks up from the song. So in other words he wont need design Artists for his AI made songs. 

l thought AI could already do that, but l think he was referring to human made songwriting and AI to do the Artwork production based on human emotion/moods. So another  one less job in the industry ( can you see where im going in this theory ? )

AI is becoming a fast new Industry in Music, many embrace and l can see why. But it also brings a lot of other future problems.

 

 Here's a question for you buckoff , if AI is doing the work of songwriters.... Who owns the royalty rights ?

 

The AI industry say it's not a problem.

Some say it a ethical question/problem.

I'm so interested to know what songwriters think.

[VoiceEx]

On 7/28/2023 at 4:54 AM, buckoff said:

She's a hellva songwriter , so study her songs a bit  , little to pop for me. Not in a bad way , I just can't go there  . What I see on shows with her , moms always around , Maybe to keep her out of trouble . What I read about her dad was a stockboker, Who knows now, they're rich 700 mil last i looked  . Who the hell is Al , I write 24/7 record them live tracks and sing them , Who gives a f*ck on a robot , if that what it is , If could afford it I'd hire a real drummer , ditch the bs drum machines 

Beat that Al , You just sunk like the Titanic , and get a real name if your so smart Albert, that little tin heart ain't breaking to do this Mafai Albert , sell out.

 

Every successful musician can serve as a case study. No argument there. Though 700 mill man that's alot of 'dough'. I'll bet if she ever has that one, single child you predicted, then he/she will have plenty of wood to chock into the industrial furnace they may have at home. Never a dull winter at the Swift household! Lifestyle of the rich and the famous, and all that 😅

 

That being said, as I mentioned before, I don't think that AI will become a substitute for actual musicians. Or, at least not in the foreseeable future. It is just a tool for now. Though I do agree with you that working with a real drummer is better than working with a drum machines. No arguments there 👍

[Jac]

1 hour ago, buckoff said:

Hits songs mean money . So if a computer can generate them its a possbilty , I'm navive on AL , first I heard of it 

royalty rights ? I'm not sure . 

Ok conumers which for the most part are kids , they might not care , they grasp on new trends . New sounds, I'm not sure really , It might be old musicans bitching hey they're using Al , If Taylor Swift said that , its probably true . it might be considered just new technology. Old artists bitched when pro tools came out , digtial replacing analog 

that's interesting thoughts, thank you for reply.

 

there is a study going on at  York uni to see if if AI generated music is liked, the participants said the didnt like it, they said it lacked, emotion and sounded robotic. That is sure to change as AI gets more advance.

[VoiceEx]

1 minute ago, buckoff said:

I'm not a major , I'm not sure what they spend on a master recording , If first your paying a major producer that makes a mil a year , lets start there , Taylor plays cowboy chords , So you can see where all them A1 sessions players come in

 

You could probably Google that information if it interests you 👍 Personally, i'm not a millionaire so I work on a budget. I'm also a cheap bastard. As such, I wouldn't pay a major producer unless I would be convinced that his services are worth my time and can outclass my own production, at least by a million to one. And even in that scenario, I would be very hesitant and test/study that MOFO in a million ways, way before i'd ever give him a dime. Talk about "trust issues", am I right 😅

[VoiceEx]

1 minute ago, buckoff said:

all them majors use producers that I see , going back to Niel Young 

 

Though why would I care about what's happening with fossils and majors? 😅 That is their business, no? Besides. If making as much money as possible was the only thing that I cared about, I would have done alot of things differently, and not just in music related productions.