How Good A Songwriter Are You?

[john]

You pretty well miss the point of the questions... They are about self perception:

 

• how you see yourself   
• how you think others see you

 

Your reply is very much about dealing with rejection, and perhaps imparting sagely wisdom while making sure you plugged your site. If only you had read the question! Lol

That aside, regarding your comment:

While I agree that indiduals offer opinions, from their perspective (as all opinions are), that does not automatically mean you should disregard their advice. An experienced person would be unlikely to offer something as simple and non-specific as "this song is bad". Indeed if someone does say that, they may as well say "Don't listen to me, I am venting".

Genuine consideration for reasoned opinions is a wise thing to do.

For example:

You are high in the Himalayas. You want to traverse across a gully. The other side is 30 feet away, but there is a 1000 foot drop between you and the other side. Luckily there are 4 snow bridges spanning the gap.

You pick one and prepare to cross. 3 other team members with your level of experience say encouraging things, and whoop with excitement. This boosts your confidence and makes you feel you have made the right choices. Your peers approve! Just wait until you cross the snow bridge and you can tell the world how right they thought you were.

Another climber of your level of experience says "You are a crap climber. You suck. Everything you do sucks." You and your gang are upset by this. You and your pals argue with him, and in the process become more determined to take the snow bridge you first selected, even though you are already giving it a second look. Being happy to have the support of the rest of your peers you celebrate by pushing the troublemaker off the edge and laughing as he falls, patting each other on the back. It's a win for team you!

Meanwhile, a more experienced climber says "I am not so sure. There are other options. Snow bridges are notoriously unreliable. Why not use the rope bridge the Sherpas put up last night? You just need to hook on and take advantage of their knowledge and skills." He points to the rope bridge, just a little further along "They don't care about being right, they just want you to cross safely". Noticing your reluctance at making a further effort, and seeing your steely-eyed determination to bask in the glory doled out by your adoring peers, he continues, "Or, if you are dead set on using a snow bridge, at least use a safety rope. I think your crazy, but it's up to you."

While you watch, a chunk falls off another snow bridge leaving it weaker, and then one almost identical to the one you plan to cross, collapses and falls into the crevice. The fourth snow bridge looks more substantial. You look at the three bridges left standing.

You look around your team and for a moment your eyes settle on your Sherpa. He's your guide. He grew up on these mountains and came from generations of climbers. He knows the environment like the back of his hand. Better. You raise a questioning brow and your Sherpa says simply:

"Snow bridge bad".

Do you:

 

 

• Carry on and cross the selected snow bridge?   
• Cross the weaker snow bridge?
• Cross the more substantial snow bridge?
• Cross a snow bridge but using a safety rope?
• Make the extra effort and cross the rope bridge?

It's life or death. Literally.

To disregard the Sherpa's comment is arrogance bordering on stupidity. Still, it is your life, your choice.

Even if the Sherpa had said nothing, the experienced climber has reasoned advice based on much more experience than you have. The snow bridge is still the snow bridge. The risk is still the same. A 1000 foot drop into strawberry jam like oblivion.

What do you do?

 

Back to the Music

Your music may not be literal life and death, but screwing it up can be damaging and wasteful. Does your music truly deserve less serious consideration? Do you value it so little?

Still your friends patted you on the back and told you it was good. That must mean something, right?

You are right, this is an industry of opinions. That does not make them all wrong.

What I would agree with is don't give up. Don't take rejection to heart.

What I think your lesson misses is that you should be prepared to learn from others, but not take what they say as definitive gospel. Challenge opinions and make decisions based on the various arguments for and against, taking account of who said what, and their experience.

Don't take comments personally. Indeed, if someone turns a comment about a song into a personal comment on you, that means they are too personally invested to be reliable.

Don't just listen. Learn to listen better.

If you are offering comment, don't make it personal. Step back. Keep your objectivity.

Alrighty, back to the original topic, self-perception....

[MonoStone]

On 12/19/2014 at 10:13 AM, EJB said:

What I find quite surprising is the low number of Peeps who pitch their Music.

I thought it would be much higher.

 

EJB

 

On 12/19/2014 at 11:25 AM, Zed McJack said:

On 12/19/2014 at 10:13 AM, EJB said:

What I find quite surprising is the low number of Peeps who pitch their Music.

I thought it would be much higher.

 

EJB

Id been more then happy to pitch any of my tunes to other musicians, but I know nothing about it. I know that if you are established composer/songwriter pitching music is pretty easy, but how we nobodies pitch music?

 

 

If only there was a site where those who already do successfully pitch, shared their experience and gave critique to those aiming to pitch. I suppose one thing Songstuff lacks is 'Pro's' willing to share their know-how from that perspective. Not many of them here. 

[john]

We have a few pro members, they just aren't very active. One of our goals for 2016 is to grow our active pro members, including recruiting new members and getting existing members re-engaged. 2015 mainly involved upgrading and changing hardware and software infrastructure. That is 95% complete. The last 5% should be finished over the next 10 days.

 

After that we focus on:

• Adding new content
• Recruitment and promotion
• Growing industry connections
• Introduce the "site supporter" member role to help cover site costs
• Launch intern programme
• Industry Training
• Launch member services including:
  • Artist Development
  • Release Services
  • Promotion and Publicity Services
  • Publication Services
  • Session Musicians
  • Recording and Mastering 
• Songwriting Workshops
• Industry jobs

There is no reason we should not achieve this, but even one of these would be a good add for our community and the site as a whole.  We plan to tackle member services one at a time. Some we will provide directly, others we plan to simply act as a hub.

 

As you mentioned improvements I thought a wee update might be useful!

[Todd M]

Kinda interesting to ask yourself some of these questions. At least for me. 

[TCgypsy]

I'm an amazing songwriter! I am just waiting for everyone else to figure that out. 

 

In all seriousness, I just enjoy the process and hearing other folks. I am doing art for its own sake. I had 3 songs published in the 80s and 90s (none were hits, lol), and I gigged quite a bit. Now I am just doing this for me, and trying to help other folks get better especially at production (if it doesn't sound good, very few people are going to care how good the song is).

 

I may try to pitch a song or two but it's not high on my priority list.

[Shanethefilmmaker]

With me it was something I had to grow into. No matter what I could never hand write notes to save my life. I was mostly good at playing chords and playing by ear.   Luckily for me I got a computer, so I was able to write by ear using notation software.

[Richard Morgan]

Cool poll. As a song writer i want recommend speakers i use. This speakers is best for classical music. Information about my speakers here  https://musiety.com/the-best-speakers-for-classical-music/

[Got The Tee Shirt]

On 12/19/2014 at 11:06 AM, arteg said:

Interesting questions! I think the main criterion for whether a song is good or bad is whether you yourself are satisfied with it.

Hi   The trouble with that as I see it based on my early work, as a Song Writer  ,  I like others

believed I was better than I actually was, at that time     

 

I never wanted pats on the back , and I believed that given time  I would master the art 

I suppose I was satisfied with a work in progress,  But as I became more aware of more

exotic chords  and tricks of the trade I naturally got better

 

The largest thing that I have learned is how does your lyrics sing,  and  as my main forte was

and still is my vocals ,  That is something that has been of great benefit in my improvement

as  both a songwriter and a stage performer

 

Just my beliefs based on many years of  experience        and of course I am still learning

 

 

 

 

[DaveKell]

I dunno if the poll is closed or I’m too dumb to figure out how it works! This comment is my only recourse apparently. I’m consistently receiving praise for my songwriting from a number of online sites. A radio program host has expressed interest in me being on his show that features songwriters. A recording studio has asked me to submit more videos to them after seeing a few I’ve posted. A very successful, yet now retired songwriter friend in Nashville has said a couple of my songs could “put the right artist on the map”. I’m slowly following through on some of this. My greatest impediment is my lifelong dearth of confidence. I began writing a few years ago at the request of my jam leader who desired new material at our weekly gathering. I quickly built a supportive fan base there. I have extreme reticence at the idea of public performing and no desire whatsoever to attempt to be an entertainer! It’s starting to look like I might soon have a few things recorded by real artists. I’ve written vastly ranging different lyrics I have no earthly idea how they came out of my brain! I’ve surmised I may be possessed by any number of long dead songwriters who are trying to still get their work out. Then again, my status as an elder hippie may indicate some lingering brain chemical anomalies from the 70’s. Who knows?

[John W Selleck]

I figured I drag this out of the mothballs and see if anyone will follow. I know I am a very good lyricist, and with the right tools I could be a very good songwriter, or with the right partner/partners, can co-write some excellent songs. Will I ever make big money out of it, doubtful; but I'll enjoy trying!

[Cody]

Great poll! Really enjoyed reading this thread too, late to the party as usual, but was still relevant for me at least  

 

Really made me question what a "pro" is.....

I have sustained myself for up to several years at several different times with nothing more than a street corner to play on/bars to stumble into that have a nice PA/sound..... all the while spitting at anyone who tries to take a cellphonetelephone video(they're always the ones that didn't have a dollar for the jar....and I'm less than interested in your myinstafaceagram account)

So "pitching" songs from me......not likely, death will stop me from putting a pen to paper though(yes I think that's still the only way to "write")

 

 

[john]

Sectretly you are of course a cool kid but just a by the by not a life goal as I see it lol

[Norlin Gonzalez]

These set of questions make you really start thinking about yourself which I like. It was really hard to answer but I think it’s important to analyze yourself first before analyzing someone else. Thanks for the set of questions.

[john]

10 hours ago, Norlin Gonzalez said:

These set of questions make you really start thinking about yourself which I like. It was really hard to answer but I think it’s important to analyze yourself first before analyzing someone else. Thanks for the set of questions.

You are welcome. It is good to have good self-awareness

[Cody]

Just bumping this cause its a good poll  and not enough people have participated