thelevellers

Excellent It's been far too long since I had the feeling of 'huh?', so that's probably just what was needed

Have you got a keyboard/piano handy? Cause middle C sits in the middle of a standard piano, making it the easiest demonstration of John's point - Everything above is treble, everything below is bass. I think middle C might be the first C on a guitar, but I'm not sure of that, it's certainly not far away at any rate!

What he said! To get a better idea try listening to some of your fav music (linkin park for example, if I remember right) and try listening specifically to the bass line, if it's not very clear for you try fiddling with the EQ on your music player (all PC media players have this function somewhere hidden in their controls) and up the bottom frequencies (the bars to the left usually) and try listening again ,ti will sound a bit rubbish as a song, but the bass line will be stronger, so you can then pick it out more easily when the EQ is normal again. Also, you could try getting some power tabs from the internet (or ask me if you don't mind what the actual band is - I have a rasonable collection) And you can then turn of the bass or guitar and listen to how the two fit together with various songs, and so help get an understanding of why people love bass guitars I can recommend listening to some Rage Against the Machine or Audioslave for some groovy bass lines in rock, Rage got me interested in trying (and eventually buying) a bass! Or even some punk will demonstrate how sometimes just a fatter sound really helps the overall song sound better ('true' punk basslines generally just follow the guitar playing the root note of each chord, pretty boring for the bassist, but it works for the genre...) Our very own Mr. Nightwolf has written at least two articles on playing bass guitar, so go check out the articles on the site too Rohan

Nah, he's not much of a signer... I think I'll just stick how I'm going about it now, slowing it right down, and working out exactly what I'm doing to try and explain it all a bit better for him... It's quite interesting, as I've never thought about it before, as strumming patterns usually come pretty naturally to me...

Interesting... I don't suppose you'd have any tips for me in teaching someone such as yourself to strum?! Failing that, I might just let him be, and get him to teach me some cool finger picking stuff... He's ahead of me as far as that stuffs concerned, he's halfway to learning classical gas I believe!

In a way I can see what you mean, but I think that this guitar is going to make some awesome new music possible, in the hands of skilled guitarists... Like I said, I would annoy everyo0ne if I had one, but then I'm justn ot very talented, so I wouldn't bother, I'll stick to learning how to control what sustain my guitars already do... Leave that beast til when I'm better or just the skilled people out there... I would still love to play with one for an hour or so... Wouldn't you?

Don't throw them away! It could just be a phase, and if you've thrown them in a permanent fashion then you may not be able to remember them... Personally I stick all such songs to the bottom of the pile, to be reconsidered at a later date, possibly with some less biased ears than mine... But I do certainly have phases of disliking much of what I have written before... P.S. Don't worry Prayag, we don't ban people for being rubbish, especially if they've improved, we'll just send you to songstuff purgatory for a while

Just out of interest, I have a friend who I intermittently teach new songs and maybe skills to, and he is adamant that it is far more natural for him to finger pick than get strumming patterns right... Is he the freak I (jokingly) call him, or is this quite common? I always assumed strumming was easier, but that's just cause it is for me really, I've never thought about it before... Anyone else learn guitar 'backwards'?

Lol, that's Reg's middle name...

Buzz-saws are more useful Personally I usually try and come up with a title first, as like tunesmith says it gives you a stronger hook, or in some cases (like my 'Stopping the World') it can help make the hook the hook, if you get me? Failing getting the title first I usually try and find it soon, as it also helps me focus the intent of the lyrics at the title, so to speak, I think 'Now your in the picture' ended up like that, I had a riff in my head, then was trying different lyrics, I think I had a verse, but it wasn't very good, and then once that line/concept appeared the rest of the song was relatively easy to write. Anyone else want to add to this?

Actually I more often have the problem of thinking 'I know exactly what I wanted to say with this lyric, but I haven't the foggiest idea of how these words represent that, or I could ever imagined they did'!!

*applauds John* For me the term sell-out varies, from the lazy type sellout that John mentioned, to the money based sell-out that neoteric mentoned. I can think of a couple of people that are odd fits in both categories, one is Green Day with their American Idiot alubm, while (I think) it's a good album, I also feel that they some how managed to sell out to the prevailing emo image, even though they had the punk/emo image all along. The other example is Feeder, their most famous song, Buck Rodgers, is clearly an example of somewhat lazy songwriting, and yet rant has proved over several albums he can write a damn good song - the key to Buck Rodgers is that he wrote it for another band, but when the band manager (or label) heard it they realised it was too good to let go. So that muddies the sell out waters yet more! But is there anyone with examples of my original question? (Not to close off the discussion, but I'm entertained by the question) Please note that it can include any aspect of songwriting, so the 'could be better' phrasing that Anne mentioned is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about

My computer is called Reg... Not sure why any more... But it's tradition...

I think that maybe you have a point, with the amount of discussion, but that's one of the reasons we like you! At least for me, I would join in more, but I don;t really have the know how to do that, so I (having, admittedly, not read ALL of you previous discussions with Lazz) kinda assumed you two were just doing just that and all was happy clappy baby dolphins... I think more discussion on here would be great, but it seems hard to get people out of the lyric review section! It would be a shame to lose one of the only people keen and knowledgeable enough to make good discussion, but I guess it might be understandable

Heh, I thought ibanez as soon as I looked at it, except for the body, so I suspect a mutt or copy too

I thought you might be, but didn't want to miss out on top tips for making the instruments last longer... Stands are useful, but cases I use only for transporting really, I have dusters

Heh, a quick googling revealed that this thread is the top result for that website (you would expect the website itself to be first if it's a good useful service, surely?) and this forum thread else where in the songwriting world. Says all we need to say I believe?

I have cases (or at least bags) for all but the bass... And I'm planning on getting stands for them... But is it really that important?! I can understand somewhat for the acoustics, as their bodies are more fragile, but why case the electrics, especially as I use 'em most days? I understand why stands would be good, but they can wait until I have money... Am I missing some huge pieces of info here? BTW, you should be aware that none of these guitars are worth much, except the JS, but that's the only one on a stand ion that pic... An intrigued Rohan...

Hmmm, I'm not much of a shredder, so I think I'll pass...

Hmm, I just noticed that the heading is not just lyricists, so I might stick in Kula Shaker and Offspring for songwriting abilities... though the more I think about it the more I realise that ALL the music I listen to I have days where that particular bands is the greatest group of songwriters in my collection! And sod it, through in Terrorvision for the catchy riffs and general greatness, and Dodgy and... No, I'll stop now...

Lol, it seems to be the only advice I ever give out, but I personally just look at the chord(s) I'm playing on the guitar, then play around with the same notes for a cool sounding bass riff, then (as I have no band to jam it with) I stick it all into guitar pro (or powertab editor) and see if it works together... This gets around my lack of music theory knowledge, and shows up if I've slipped out of key (usually), so I can fix it. I should add (as I have in at least one other thread) that I do expect that any bass player that I get to play my songs will have a play around and change what I've come up with, I just like to make an effort myself, at least to get the right feel across, and also help me feel I've got a more complete song, especially as I seem to write songs that really rely on the bass line to make it stand out... I think trial and error are wonderful teachers

I don't have enough guitars yet, but as I don't take great care of the ones I do, then maybe that's a good thing I do have a good number of instruments at the moment though, check it out!

I'll confess I didn't know such things existed... What are the benefits etc? It might conceivably gimme an excuse to get another axe

I'd just like to add another kick in the teeth to Norton - you pay for that, and yet AVG do a completely FREE virus scanner that is better... And doesn;t eat your computer for breakfast... Free stuff is usually best

A quick google reveals that it isn't necessarily an Acer specific recovery console, that it could just be the windows (i'm guessing XP) recovery tool, which is easy to get hold of, if you (or another friend) have a copy you should be able to use that, you shouldn't need his license key to just recover/de-break stuff... Another option would be d/ling a copy of XP from the almighty internet - but that being illegal (even if you are using it to fix a legit copy of windows) I wouldn't recommend it! Good luck, I'm assuming it's preventing you getting the data of it? Otherwise I'd say screw it and reinstall using (if it's still accessible) his key and someone else CD... Oh, or you could just switch to a good operating system like Fedora