Challenge #16 What's The Gist Lyricist?

[john]

I can see why the confusion arose. What i wrote was...

Whose Lyrics You Are Assigned To Critique

Kel - Donna, Goldy

Donna - Rudi, Lisa

Rudi - Jan, Kel

Jan - Vagda, Donna

Vagda - Goldy, Rudi

Goldy - Lisa, Jan

Lisa - Kel, Vagda

Unfortunately although implicit in the order it isn't as clear as it could be.

It's a bit of a mess, my bad...

eek!

It should be as you have inerpreted it Rudi. Kel is assigned to crit Donna and Goldy. Each of you should be critiquing two works (as per the original post).

Donna, I am not siure how you ended up critiquing Goldy, that's completely thrown me lol!

*note to self, be explicit!

[Rudi]

I can see why the confusion arose. What i wrote was...

 

Whose Lyrics You Are Assigned To Critique

Kel - Donna, Goldy

Donna - Rudi, Lisa

Rudi - Jan, Kel

Jan - Vagda, Donna

Vagda - Goldy, Rudi

Goldy - Lisa, Jan

Lisa - Kel, Vagda

 

Unfortunately although implicit in the order it isn't as clear as it could be.

 

It's a bit of a mess, my bad...

 

Its still not clear.

 

Have I got wrong?

 

If so, how about a deadline extension?

[DonnaMarilyn]

Oops! Sorry, John! I meant to write that I had critiqued Rudi and Lisa. So all is well.

[goldylocks]

 I just critiqued Lisa, one person to two people, mine being Lisa and Jan, is how I read it. It has to be right if Donna's critiquing Lisa and Rudi. This sounds like Abott Lou's Costello's Who's on First Base.
 


Goldy

Edited October 8, 2013 by goldylocks

[john]

Okay, extension to Sunday.

 

Just to be absolutely clear:

 

Kel critiques the work of Donna and Goldy
Donna critiques Rudi and Lisa
Rudi critiques Jan and Kel
Jan critiques Vagda and Donna
Vagda critiques Goldy and Rudi
Goldy critiques Lisa and Jan
Lisa critiques Kel and Vagda

[Rudi]

Thank you John.

 

Hang on though. Sunday was already the deadline. Or is that your impish way of saying there is no extension?

 

Oh well, back to the drawing board.

 

I'm turning in now.

 

Night night...

 

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz 

Edited October 8, 2013 by Rudi

[JDHarris]

I've tried to complete everything before this weekend, Saturday I'm preparing for Thanksgiving dinner I host every year.  Canada Thanksgiving is this coming Monday, but I do the dinner on the Sunday.

 

How long will we have to rewrite our draft.  I see no one has critiqued mine yet.  Too hopeless for words eh? 

 

I can take it, honestly, I can.  Except if you only write "rewrite" 500 times.  Then I don't know??

 

Jan

[john]

To be honest as long as things are done in a reasonably timely manner I will be happy. It is the process and the understanding of what is gained by using it that I really want to being grasped and used. That is far more important than any time constraint.

In fact, please use the critique discussion right up to the point you feel your work is complete. Time restraint wise I think the restraint regarding delivery of a draft was the important one as you all needed that as a prerequisite to starting the critique process.

So let's say that as long as we get the lyrics finished by not this Friday but next Friday, October 18, I will be happy.

Equally if you finish beforehand just let me know and I will take a look at the topics, the draft and the finished work.

I have been busy drafting guidelines for future critique assessments for level 1, 2 and 3. In future each will require some prep work and level 3 will include a 1 to 1 chat as part of the assessment. I am taking it seriously enough to be thinking of it as if it were a fully accredited course. After all, I want you to get the maximum benefit possible, or at least make that available to you.

Yes, I know this has been sparked from the lyrics challenge, but it is something I was considering and it does overlap with the purpose of the group.

In the not too distant future I plan to put together a few songwriting workshops /seminars with some guest presenters. I am hopeful this will be free. Perhaps some of you will be interested?

Oh, I am also thinking of putting together a music writing challenge group. Hopefully that will also be useful should we want to do some collaborations, ie members of the two challenge groups could team up. Perhaps also a production challenge and a music marketing challenge (the last built from our current music marketing group) as I think we have something valuable here in the challenge format as a useful and entertaining way to expand skills and experience. I just need to spend a little time to come up with a development plan and provide necessary support and learning materials for each challenge group and each course.

The problem isn't lack of knowledge, it's all going to be about available time. As you guys know I will be bringing out some products which will include 1 to 1 mentoring, group mentoring, subscription courses, ebooks, software and even blog themes. I think Songstuff will benefit from me adding a business side of things to all the free stuff we already do, (and still plan to do!) For one I will be full time, for another we will have a decent budget. Plus I will really be able to turn what I envision into reality, including augmenting what we have with other full time staff and getting some of my friends in the biz to become even more involved, less in the background. Exciting times!

I digress lmao

[Lisa Gates]

John,

Thank God you digress! I met a songwriter today at the grocery story and invited him to SS. He just laughed when I apologized for being so excited and long winded about the community. I can't imagine anyone with any music goals popping on to SS  and not loving what we have here!.

You digress anytime you want.

Lisa

[Rudi]

I want to make an observation that 500 words is IMO far too much for the task.

 

I will do it but it could be done better with fewer words (IMO).

[JDHarris]

I really like were all this SS is heading.  I have introduced several friends to SS all with varying musical interests.    

 

It's almost midnight here, Wednesday morn and I have not had my lyric critiqued yet.  I don't think Kel has had a response to his lyric draft either.  We both have had views, but no critiques. 

 

I think Kel has given great critiques, very in depth, and really seems to know what he is talking about.  Well respected gives valuable positive critique.  I on the other hand really have no idea what I'm saying. Basically I tried to cover most points and struggled to make it to 500 words.  After reading Kels critique of his assigned lyrics, I can see where  I need to go and do more research. 

 

OK, I've just heard from Rudi and he's on it. 

Thanks

Jan

[Kel]

I really like were all this SS is heading.  I have introduced several friends to SS all with varying musical interests.    

 

It's almost midnight here, Wednesday morn and I have not had my lyric critiqued yet.  I don't think Kel has had a response to his lyric draft either.  We both have had views, but no critiques. 

 

I think Kel has given great critiques, very in depth, and really seems to know what he is talking about.  Well respected gives valuable positive critique.  I on the other hand really have no idea what I'm saying. Basically I tried to cover most points and struggled to make it to 500 words.  After reading Kels critique of his assigned lyrics, I can see where  I need to go and do more research. 

 

OK, I've just heard from Rudi and he's on it. 

Thanks

Jan

Hi Jan,

 

Thanks for your comments. My critiques are far from perfect, and I often miss things. But I think that is good; if everyone saw every little thing that one person thought could be improved many would be disheartened or worse, think that detailed critique is a polite way of saying awful.

 

I was trained in critique through the Toastmasters organisation. Public speaking is many peoples' worst phobia, yet is part of our everyday life. Toastmasters gives every bit as much development into critiquing as they do into speechwriting, and it's really all about the basics. 

 

Make sure the recipient understands the critique is your opinion based upon your understanding, and not the last word of God on the subject.

 

Tell them what they need to know, but suggest something to think about, or a path that may not be so obvious. Or at least what it made you feel, or even that it didn't make you feel anything.

 

Tell them what worked, and why it worked, so they can continue doing the right things as well as changing what doesn't work.

 

Encourage them. I personally never say that I like something if I don't,and rarely if I do, and in reality whether I like something or not isn't important. If you can't find anything positive to say at all, look at the technical side of things based on your understanding of the craft/subject.

 

Lastly, remind them it's your opinion based upon your understanding and you are not the last word on the subject (even if you are!)

 

Cheers,

Kel

Edited October 9, 2013 by Kel

[Vagdavercustis]

I'm really sorry I havent put my critiques on here. I've been so bussy I barely have time for internet. I'll do my best to critque the lyrics this evening!

[Lisa Gates]

I really like were all this SS is heading.  I have introduced several friends to SS all with varying musical interests.    

 

It's almost midnight here, Wednesday morn and I have not had my lyric critiqued yet.  I don't think Kel has had a response to his lyric draft either.  We both have had views, but no critiques. 

 

I think Kel has given great critiques, very in depth, and really seems to know what he is talking about.  Well respected gives valuable positive critique.  I on the other hand really have no idea what I'm saying. Basically I tried to cover most points and struggled to make it to 500 words.  After reading Kels critique of his assigned lyrics, I can see where  I need to go and do more research. 

 

OK, I've just heard from Rudi and he's on it. 

Thanks

Jan

Jan,

Because Kel gives great critiques is the reason I am not posting quickly. I want to give a complete well thought out critique. I have looked at his posted lyrics and am combining my notes. I wish I had a time I could sit and just do music. but alas...i have the day job and long drive home...dang it eats up time!

I have gotten my two reviews already and they are both extremly detailed and so wonderfully helpful. Oops! I still have to respond to them too! I'm on it! I'm going as fast as I can but still want to do the best.

Jan, be patient. We are all going to help each other out here. One way or another. I love it here on SS!

[john]

I want to make an observation that 500 words is IMO far too much for the task.

 

I will do it but it could be done better with fewer words (IMO).

It is interesting what people's concept of 500 words is. Your crit for Jan was more than double what was needed at 1,169 words! At least it was quite thorough

[Rudi]

It is interesting what people's concept of 500 words is. Your crit for Jan was more than double what was needed at 1,169 words! At least it was quite thorough

Trust you to go checking up on me!

 

Given a free hand I probably would picked up on one or two points and then portioned out the rest of the critique over another couple of goes.

 

However, having done things your way, it was a positive experience and I can genuinely see the benefit of it (I dont know about poor Jan though!!!   ).

[DonnaMarilyn]

I'm losing track now. Given that everyone has provided and received their critiques, and we can now begin revising, is there a deadline date for the revised versions?

 

Donna

[john]

Hi Donna

It's buried in a post back there somewhere. The final deadline is next Friday, October 18.

[Kel]

Hey John,

 

I was wondering, does the rewrite (finished work) need to have all the requirements you set for the first draft?

 

i.e. 3 verses, pre-chorus, chorus & bridge

 

Cheers,

Kel

[john]

Nah. For our purposes here I don't think it is an important criteria or restriction.